ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: joe_and_jeep on January 15, 2006, 10:28:10 PM
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Well I lifted the Tracker tonight. 2" spacer in the rear and 1.75 up front. I think the 1.75 is too much. I flipped the upper mounts and when driving it feels fine but if I hit a small bump the struts dont have eneough down travel I can feel them reach there limits. So I think I am gonna cut the spacer down to 1.5".  But is .25 really that much overkill? I still have the stock isolators in, dont know if I was supposed to take them out.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v384/joe_and_jeep/100_1162.jpg)
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Or a 2" strut spacer?
cause the 1 3/4" spacer makes the front about 3"inch lift.
Since the spring sits inboard more, you get more leverage from the little spacer.
I think the rule of thumb for Kicks is
1 1/2 Xs the spacer is the actual lift out towards the wheel.
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Yep, you need more strut travel
a strut spacer will work, but you
have to make it
Wild
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and 3" is an awful lot of lift without lowering the front diff... the cv's probably aren't too happy right now...
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I'm gonna make the strut spacer tomorrow. Will the CV axles be ok for a little bit? I got manual hubs and usually leave them unlocked on the street during the winter.
I am gonna trim the spacer but after fighting all the rusty bolts I am not real thrilled about tearing back into it. So if the front can stay where its at for a little bit then will just leave it for a week or two.
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Yes, if you don't drive with it in lock,
you will be fine. Make your spacer 2-3/4"
not 3" and you need to flip the rubber
on the top back to stock position, if you
go over 2-3/4" you risk running the balls
in the CV against the wire retainer, not good
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where did you find 2" and 1.75" spacers for that? I want some I think
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Contact Digger, he makes them
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thanks
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Ohh, wait Digger makes Spring spacers,
did you need spring or strut spacers ???
Wild
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Make your spacer 2-3/4"
not 3" and you need to flip the rubber
on the top back to stock position, if you
go over 2-3/4" you risk running the balls
in the CV against the wire retainer, not good
My front coil spacer is 1.75. What rubber on top? I flipped the strut mount for a little more down travel. I used Jeep coil spacers. Theyre about $20 - $40 for 4 1.75" spacers used.
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I make 1" and 1-1/2" spacers. I don't have access to thicker material and besides 1-1/2" worth of spacer up front is about as tall as you'd want to go without relocating the diff to lessen cv stress. The 1-1/2" spacers provide around 2-1/4 to 2-1/2" of front lift...
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so does that meen you have to put a little more in the rear . so it doesn't sit funny....like looking up at the moon.....
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Actually it levels the truck very nicely. Most Track/kicks sit a little nose-down anyway.
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hmmmm well i must be one of the lucky ones then..lol not to worried about it though.. i still gotta put my camber bolts in.. found out i gotta do the lower ball joints to... easy jobs..... and a good reason to have some nice cold beers...mmmmmmmmmmmmmm beer
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Why, is yours sitting nose-high? Shoot me an email so I might be able to help you out. SnakebiteEMS|removethispart|@hotmail.com
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what do you make your coil spacers out of and how do you do it? with the 1.2" spacers do you need to flip the strut mounts? and how do you do so? I have a 2000 grand vitara.. would work with the same spacers a kick would for sure though.
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i think diggers kit is for the earlier models threw to 98,, i think un less he building the new style now... not sure... but his way is a good cheap way 8) i know i'm happy with it ;D
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I make them out of UHMW Polyetheylene. The same material used in "Professional" spacers. If you search around here, you'll find a topic I created on how to make your own spacers. It's very informative reading;) LOL! I have never tested my spacers on a newer style tracker, so I don't want to tell you for sure that they would work fine. Check out the garage sale forum, there's another person selling a complete lift kit for the newer style trackers and he put considerable time and effort into making a nice complete kit.
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Here's the other kit I told you about:
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=8494.0
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Thanks man, I'll look for that other topic. I am positive the spacers for a kick would work for my GV though because Rocky road's spacers fit GV's XL7's, sidekicks and trackers... thanks for the link for that guy's lift kit
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There was a company on ebay that offered the strut spacers with a spring spacers kit for sidekicks/trackers. I contacted them to see if they would sell just the spacers and they said yes, and I "think" they were $35. But it is my understanding the mount flip should be what you need. Although my struts are stuck in the rubber mount and I can't flip mine....:-(
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what do you have? I was looking at mine and I can't figure out how the strut bar would still work it the mounts were flipped
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Nate and Heather again.
It's the only How-Tos I have earmarked.
http://www.zuwharrie.com/content/view/11/27/1/1/
Strut mount flip. ;D
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what do you have? I was looking at mine and I can't figure out how the strut bar would still work it the mounts were flipped
I seem to recall someone saying that the GV strut top mounts were different.
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what do you have? I was looking at mine and I can't figure out how the strut bar would still work it the mounts were flipped
I seem to recall someone saying that the GV strut top mounts were different.
I think they have a strut tower bar too for added strength and support, that might be the problem, or causing confusion??
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The GV mounts are different. First they are bigger and taller, if you could flip them you would get at least 4-6" of extra down travel, way too much. Also if you flip them you would not be able to use the the strut brace. Flipping the strut mounts on the GV's is not an option.
You will need to either buy longer struts (OME) or use strut spacers. If you use strut spacers you will have to do something to relocate the brace (raise it up higher since to the mount was lowered). Here are some pics of the sidekick strut mount next to the GV strut mount that I grabbed from Jagular7's Webshots (which are no longer available)
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(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v384/joe_and_jeep/100_1177.jpg)
I flipped mine, punched out the studs and put the studs back thru upside down and reinstalled from the bottom. The pic is looking up from the wheelwell.
So whats that considered a strut mount? An new pair of struts come with it?
I cut the spacer down, now I am at 1" 7/16 plus the isolater. That right now? And where do I get the camber correction kit? How do you adjust camber on these?
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There is no provision on a stock track/kick to correct camber. You have to get creative. If you have wider wheels, sometimes the extra leverage they create will help put camber back in spec. Other things you can do is get a camber bolt set or even grind out the upper hole on the lower mount to spindle to get some adjustment, use big washers and tighten the bolt, then once it's in the right spot, tack weld the washers to the strut so they can't slide...
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I loosend the lower mount hoping it would be adjustable like so many millions of cars with struts but nope. I was thinking about going to Lows and getting a Grade 8 bolt and notching it a little bit on the shank to allow some adjustment. Anyone try that or is that what the $16 bolt is?
I think I will probably tear the damn thing apart for the third time and slot the strut on the lower mount.
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If you search "camber" on the site there's all kinds of info on camber correction. My favorite is one Digger mentioned - grinding the top hole to make it adjustable.  ( )  --->  (    )
I wouldn't be shy to do this, some aftermarket replacement struts(for other vehicles)have this done for adjustment.
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I was thinking about going to Lows and getting a Grade 8 bolt and notching it a little bit on the shank to allow some adjustment. Anyone try that or is that what the $16 bolt is?
NO!!!
I think I will probably tear the damn thing apart for the third time and slot the strut on the lower mount.
Yes, upper hole, lower strut mount. With about 2" lift you could remove the upper bolt, push the knuckle in till it hits the strut body, and grind away till the bolt goes through nicely, then clean up the hole.
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The GV mounts are different. First they are bigger and taller, if you could flip them you would get at least 4-6" of extra down travel, way too much. Also if you flip them you would not be able to use the the strut brace. Flipping the strut mounts on the GV's is not an option.ÂÂ
You will need to either buy longer struts (OME) or use strut spacers. If you use strut spacers you will have to do something to relocate the brace (raise it up higher since to the mount was lowered). Here are some pics of the sidekick strut mount next to the GV strut mount that I grabbed from Jagular7's Webshots (which are no longer available)
thank you, I am not confused anymore. all this time I thought the kick mounts were the same as gv ones and I couldn't figure out what was going on with the flipped mounts.. I will have to figure something else out as far as a spacer or just get new struts when and if I lift it. thanks to all of you
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i just went to the tire shop and bought .camber bolts to readjust.. were only 30 bucks.. realeasy to do ,, just have to take topp strut bolt out and replace it with the new one..then yo can get it aligned properly..
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I put 2" spacers up front in my gf's and 2.5 in the rear, camber bolts, long shocks ( to long the coils keep poping out while flexing )... need some strut spacers, the mount flip isnt cutting it, still fun though ;D (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v455/trev_guy/firstrun018.jpg)
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BDS makes a strut extension and sells them in their 2" kit, they do sell them seprately. They screw on the end of your strut shaft and add 2" length.
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http://www.bds-suspension.com/suspensionsystems_2suzuki.html
Very insteresting, that looks like it would work better than using a spacer that drops the strut tower. Especially on the 99+ that have a tower brace.
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Theyre extension looks easy to make. I guess a trip to the hardware store for this weekend.
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anybody every put that bds setup on a 99+ kick? i'm looking for the strut spacers specifically.
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I haven't heard of any 99+ models with the BDS lift. The strut spacers look like they just screw onto the top of the shaft and make it longer. Since the GV's and Sidekicks use the same struts I can't imagine that there would be a problem using them.
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Did a little calling around and got some more info on the strut extensions. My local distributor and his contact at BDS couldn't find them (they came packaged with the front coils). So I called a rep at BDS and got a part number. With the part number my local distributor is able to order them.
BDS Strut Extension
Suzuki Sidekick and Geo Tracker
Part# FSE3
$29.95 each (you need a pair)
Now I just have to decide if I want to try another work around for my problem or pay $60 for a pair of these. Makes you wonder if you could just buy some steel rod, drill it, tap it, and thread the top. It would be very tempting if I had access to a drill press.
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i just got off the phone with bds and they weren't very helpful, told me in no way could i only purchase the extensions.... didn't seem impressed when i said i had a part # after being told there wasn't one available for the item.... i don't know what these things even look like but sounds easier than putting spacers up front and dealing with the strut bar afterwards.. do you have a link where i could find some pics? tnx
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These would be easy to make,
I have a friend with a mill and a lathe
I'll see what they would cost to get made
Wild
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These would be easy to make,
I have a friend with a mill and a lathe
I'll see what they would cost to get made
Wild
That's what I was thinking. With the proper tools it's should be simple, and for the 2nd gen vehicles with a strut tower brace it is a much better option that dropping/flipping the mount.
i just got off the phone with bds and they weren't very helpful, told me in no way could i only purchase the extensions.... didn't seem impressed when i said i had a part # after being told there wasn't one available for the item.... i don't know what these things even look like but sounds easier than putting spacers up front and dealing with the strut bar afterwards.. do you have a link where i could find some pics? tnx
Try calling another BDS Distributor (you have to buy from the distributors and not directly from BDS anyways). The distributor I called said you could only buy it with the front coil kit, but when I gave him the part # I was looking for he tried again. Both the distributor and his factory rep were amazed that it was available with the right part number. The only pics I have seen is the small one from the BDS website. It's the 2 bolts on the top in the middle.
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I've always had good luck e-mailing BDS concerning these - but my local didtributor is not very helpful.
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These would be easy to make,
I have a friend with a mill and a lathe
I'll see what they would cost to get made
Wild
Hey Wild, any idea if this will be happening... soon. I want to install my lift in the next 2-3 weeks and I need to figure out what I am going to do with the brace.
Thanks,
The_Maplebar
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I'd be interested as well. It beats having to cut up and weld the strut brace or spend damn near $300 on OME front struts.
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trying to figure out diff lengths for strut spacer(JDMCRX's), extension(BDS) & OME strut, i couldn't get the difference in length from stock 99+ and OME struts, but was given length's, OME is 501mm (19.75inches) extended and 318mm (12.5inches) compressed. when i get the stock lengths i'll post up right away, trying with manufacturer now.... gm..... ...
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I know the older Tracker/Kick struts fit so the dimensions should be the same for stock. This is off of NAPA's site:
Compressed Length:8.750"
Extended length:15.250"
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Oh yeah, call the local Suzuki dealer and ask them for a similar year Grand Vitara. The Chevy dealer would likely just call up the Suzuki dealer to get the parts anyways.
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trying to figure out diff lengths for strut spacer(JDMCRX's), extension(BDS) & OME strut, i couldn't get the difference in length from stock 99+ and OME struts, but was given length's, OME is 501mm (19.75inches) extended and 318mm (12.5inches) compressed. when i get the stock lengths i'll post up right away, trying with manufacturer now.... gm..... ...
That sounds like the shocks to me. The notes I have are:
STRUTS
Compressed: 8.75"
Extended: 15.25"
SHOCKS
Compressed: 11.5-12.0"
Extended: 18.25"
The OME struts are supposed to be about 1" (25mm) longer. Although I think I have heard 30-40mm also. It would be nice to have a reliable FAQ with this information so you don't have to rely on hearsay.
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Has anyone ever dug through a parts book and tried to find a strut that mounts the same and is just longer? I may have to do that next time I am at the parts store back home.
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I've heard a reference to Subaru Struts, but never had a sheet/book where I could just browse through the lengths.
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Has anyone ever dug through a parts book and tried to find a strut that mounts the same and is just longer? I may have to do that next time I am at the parts store back home.
I've heards 86 Colt Vista AWD stryts are 2.5" longer, same style strut, and mounts the same. But for me, checking is hard because no parts stores have any to compare, and they won't order just for me to verify something :P
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Has anyone ever dug through a parts book and tried to find a strut that mounts the same and is just longer? I may have to do that next time I am at the parts store back home.
I've heards 86 Colt Vista AWD stryts are 2.5" longer, same style strut, and mounts the same. But for me, checking is hard because no parts stores have any to compare, and they won't order just for me to verify something :P
These are the numbers NAPA lists for a '86 Dodge Colt Vista FWD, but they don't make any mentions to AWD being an option.
Compressed Length:11.750"
Extended length:18.875"
(http://partimages.genpt.com/partimages/157979.jpg)
Well, looks like it could work. Someone would have to get one and check it out for sure.
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If I remember to write all this down, I am friends with some parts store people back home and i will dig around the books and see what I can find. They already told me that they will order something for me to see if it would fit or not.
I need new struts anyway since I can't seem to get mine out of the freaking mount at the top to flip it anyway. I have tried everything, PB blaster, 2x4 and 3lb hammer....screwest thing I have seen. :D
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Has anyone ever dug through a parts book and tried to find a strut that mounts the same and is just longer? I may have to do that next time I am at the parts store back home.
I've heards 86 Colt Vista AWD stryts are 2.5" longer, same style strut, and mounts the same. But for me, checking is hard because no parts stores have any to compare, and they won't order just for me to verify something :P
These are the numbers NAPA lists for a '86 Dodge Colt Vista FWD, but they don't make any mentions to AWD being an option.
Compressed Length:11.750"
Extended length:18.875"
([url]http://partimages.genpt.com/partimages/157979.jpg[/url])
Well, looks like it could work. Someone would have to get one and check it out for sure.
Sorry, it was 4wd i think. If you look here at a thread you created, there are viewable files with strut types/dimension for x reference. You could just jot down anything that is a B12 type strut to lessen the list, and start eliminating ones that definatly will not work.
http://bbs.zuwharrie.com/content/topic,29597.0.html
The poster mentioned he was using them on his trackick. But just looking at the spec sheet between the 2 struts, they don't look like a very good choice, I made a call tonight and a Canadian Tire about 40 miniutes away from me has one(yes, just one), I may go this weekend to actually put my hands on it and compare it to the stock trackick strut. If it works, it would be a good(cheap) alternative to the OME strut, although the quality wouldn't be there.
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That turkey never called me back :P
I'm working on several things, but I
could get these made in a few days,
IF he's not out of town
Price, well I guess they have to be
less than $30 ea huh ;)
I'll go visit him in the morning
Wild
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http://www.napaonline.com/masterpages/NOLMaster.aspx?PageId=470&LineCode=NS&PartNumber=71843SS&Description=Strut+-+Sensa-Trac+-+Front
That's the only option you get for a complete shock from NAPA and it is that part number ricky gave in the other thread, along with being a Sensa-Track. I doubt since Colts were FWD the front strut would be any different FWD or AWD. I also don't know if the AWD version was ever available in AWD or FWD here in Canada or the USA. Not saying NAPA is the end all debate settler but as you go through looking for an '86 Dodge Colt Vista it doesn't ask you about any AWD option. Just states if it's a 4 door station wagon or you don't know and then FWD or you don't know. I clicked don't know for both and got the same results as if I had clicked the other two options.
With the lengths of that shock I'd say it's the one he was referring to and it would be a noticeable improvement over stock. Maybe not as long as OME but then it would also cost you a few hundred less to own a set.
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[url]http://www.napaonline.com/masterpages/NOLMaster.aspx?PageId=470&LineCode=NS&PartNumber=71843SS&Description=Strut+-+Sensa-Trac+-+Front[/url]
That's the only option you get for a complete shock from NAPA and it is that part number ricky gave in the other thread, along with being a Sensa-Track. I doubt since Colts were FWD the front strut would be any different FWD or AWD. I also don't know if the AWD version was ever available in AWD or FWD here in Canada or the USA. Not saying NAPA is the end all debate settler but as you go through looking for an '86 Dodge Colt Vista it doesn't ask you about any AWD option. Just states if it's a 4 door station wagon or you don't know and then FWD or you don't know. I clicked don't know for both and got the same results as if I had clicked the other two options.
With the lengths of that shock I'd say it's the one he was referring to and it would be a noticeable improvement over stock. Maybe not as long as OME but then it would also cost you a few hundred less to own a set.
The pic they show - That can't be it, it must be a "universal pic" - you would have to grind off the spring cup.
AWD or FWD there should be no difference anyway as the front *should* be setup the same for both, for an AWD the tranny would possibly have some sort of output shaft to go to a rear diff, to drive the rear. If the parts store will let me(if I go), I'm going to get pics of the strut compared to the sidekick strut.
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I know it's not on their site but. Sky manufacturing has a whole kit with spacers and bolts etc etc. He has it all figured out with the proper sizes for each component. He is selling them on ebay or you can buy them direct. It even comes with shock relocation brackets so you can use your stock shocks. (kind of a nice feature cause I have dented every set of shocks i have ever had on a lifted kick) It's cheap too. Currently 90 bucks on ebay. I'm not sure what they retail for but that's damn near the cheapest lift I have seen yet. That kit and a 2" body lift and you can run some considerably larger tires.
here is a pic off of ebay.
later
Hutch
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I'll be getting the steel on Monday, He
is going to start machining as soon as
I get it to him.
I'm starting with 5 sets and I asked him
how much, trying to get the cost at about
$50 for the pair, but he said he would have
to see how long it takes to turn them out
This might be a prototype pair to start and
have them CNC mass produced to reduce
costs as well as increase production #s
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My little brother is getting a CNC lathe to start doing some sideowork. My unlces machine shop is getting swamped. If he manages to get it, them extensions would take no time to machine on a CNC. That flat spot tho, have to chuck it in a mill or grind it in. To keep costs down, I wouldn't put it in, I'd let the customer grind it in. It would take another machine and setup time. That would add 15 minutes to the machine time. I dont know the going rate of labor/machine time but that 15minutes could cost an additional $15. Maybe do it as an option.
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I know it's not on their site but. Sky manufacturing has a whole kit with spacers and bolts etc etc. He has it all figured out with the proper sizes for each component. He is selling them on ebay or you can buy them direct. It even comes with shock relocation brackets so you can use your stock shocks. (kind of a nice feature cause I have dented every set of shocks i have ever had on a lifted kick) It's cheap too. Currently 90 bucks on ebay. I'm not sure what they retail for but that's damn near the cheapest lift I have seen yet. That kit and a 2" body lift and you can run some considerably larger tires.
here is a pic off of ebay.
later
Hutch
That looks like a nice kit - I checked ebay and couldn't find it, I'd like to get a set of the rear shock mounts ;D
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I'll be getting the steel on Monday, He
is going to start machining as soon as
I get it to him.
I'm starting with 5 sets and I asked him
how much, trying to get the cost at about
$50 for the pair, but he said he would have
to see how long it takes to turn them out
This might be a prototype pair to start and
have them CNC mass produced to reduce
costs as well as increase production #s
How long are we going to make the extensions? 2"?
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2-1/2" do you think you want 2" instead ?
I know 2-1/2" is safe, I am running 3" and I
think it's a little too long, these should be great
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Nope, I frankly had no clue what the length should be. I just think BDS calls theirs 2" if I'm not mistaken. I'd rather have too long of a shock as long as it won't bottom out.
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Anything will bottom out if you jump high enough
;D
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Don't tempt the wife. :P
She had it about 2 months, walks up to me, and says, "would you be mad if I told you the GV goes 120mph?" :o