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ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: 89sami97jeep on February 02, 2005, 06:35:55 AM

Title: why all the hate?
Post by: 89sami97jeep on February 02, 2005, 06:35:55 AM
i was just looking on here and ive noticed that most of you guys dislike jeeps and any thing non suzuki.....what givs? i have a jeep and a sami that i 'wheel and i like driving them both the same.  just my thoughts
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Bobzooki on February 02, 2005, 06:39:37 AM
It's "mock hate".  We don't hate Jeeps.  We may laugh at their attitude of superiority, and their "Jeep Thing", and their "Trail Rated" stuff.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Cwkick on February 02, 2005, 06:41:15 AM
I don't think anyone on here hates Jeeps or other brands.  Most others think Zuks of any kind are just play toys and not REAL 4x4's.

I think it's just good razzing among the off road groups.

I used to have a TJ and didn't care for the way most of the other Jeep owners thought about anything that wasn't a Jeep.  (only in a Jeep...)  Whatever.  ::)

Cwkick
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: mrfuelish on February 02, 2005, 07:15:05 AM
I like jeeps     they taste like chicken  ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: nc_zuk on February 02, 2005, 07:19:48 AM
I like wheeling with Jeepers. Gives me a chance to exercise my Warn 9000 winch ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Real_Red_Sammi on February 02, 2005, 07:28:58 AM
   Yeah I don't mind showing up the jeeps, then pulling them out of the mud, or water ;D! It's good for a laugh because jeep people are pretty hard core about there rigs, I could care less it's just fun to Make It Hert, but it is great to have a good laugh at someone else expence!!! ;D
   LMS!!!
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: szabotage on February 02, 2005, 09:16:21 AM
Quote
i was just looking on here and ive noticed that most of you guys dislike jeeps and any thing non suzuki.....what givs? i have a jeep and a sami that i 'wheel and i like driving them both the same.  just my thoughts


you get haters from all groups, I'm sure.  You can't tell me jeep owners are innocent of the same accusations your laying on suzuki owners now are you?

I've seen it plenty of times when I tell a jeep owner what i drive, I get the rolling eyes look. I'm not accusing all jeep owners, just some and to those I take it all in good humour,  some of my very good friends are jeep owners and I don't judge them any different.

we do razz each other once in a while, but it's all in good fun and nobody goes home with hurt feelings. that's how I see it on the trail and on the forums, so I think you should chillout a tad an stop taking it so personally

lets keep in mind here, whatever we own we still share one thing in common,  the love of 4 wheelin ;)
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Natebert on February 02, 2005, 09:25:55 AM
I like Jeeps, right under my tires.

But seriously, I don't think that anybody on this board hates Jeeps.  As a matter of fact. I'd be that most of us primarily wheel with Jeeps.  

Thusly, I'd bet that most of us have been razzed by Jeep owners about having a 'girly jeep' or a 'wanna-be jeep' because of our Suzukis and we get great opportunities to vent that here.  

Besides, aren't Suzukis better then Jeeps anyway?

~Nate

Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Hemogoblin on February 02, 2005, 09:38:58 AM
I had a Samurai, actually two, and won't be going back to them.  Why?  Well, they're too small (inside at least), and underpowered.  I had a 4.3L in mine, Toy axles, 35s, blah, blah, blah.... and yes, it was fun but I would have prefered to have just bought a Jeep, added a blower, and been done with.  Yes, it would cost more, it wouldn't be as original, and I'd get a bunch of flamers waving at me, but besides ALL that, it would be comfortable and a very decent daily driver.

And most Jeepers don't hate all.  It's the losers who go out and buy a new Jeep, add some new bumpers, nerf bars, and plus 1 tires, and hit the local mud puddle.  These same guys roll around town for days without cleaning the mud off their rigs, top down, and give everyone the "hey, look at my cool rig."  LOL  
And then I would pull up in my Zuk.... and they'd stop looking around....

Cheers,
Steve  
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: explosivo on February 02, 2005, 09:47:27 AM
Quote
I don't think anyone on here hates Jeeps or other brands.  Most others think Zuks of any kind are just play toys and not REAL 4x4's.

I think it's just good razzing among the off road groups.

I used to have a TJ and didn't care for the way most of the other Jeep owners thought about anything that wasn't a Jeep.  (only in a Jeep...)  Whatever.  ::)

Cwkick

I always thought the catch-phrase 'only in a Jeep' was kind've amusing, since the majority of older Jeeps have swapped in Chevy/Ford drivetrain stuff :P

But yeah, I have no problems with Jeeps.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: mrfuelish on February 02, 2005, 10:21:07 AM
When I go wheeling I have to take at least a couple of jeeps with me so I know how to rate the trail, when three jeeps get stuck I know the trail is rated a three, when four jeeps get stuck I know it's a four and so on.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Natebert on February 02, 2005, 10:30:23 AM
Quote
When I go wheeling I have to take at least a couple of jeeps with me so I know how to rate the trail, when three jeeps get stuck I know the trail is rated a three, when four jeeps get stuck I know it's a four and so on.


That is FUNNY!

"It's rated 4 Joe!  Maybe we shouldn't try it without our Zuki friends."

~Nate
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: explosivo on February 02, 2005, 11:44:03 AM
LOL, I like that ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on February 02, 2005, 11:59:51 AM
  I Know Im gonna get some people upset with this response but I know Im not the only person that feels this way.
 
 Try going on a Jeep ride in a Geo! Jeeps arent the problem, its the owners. Obviosly not all jeep owners but a hell of a lot of em. Ive had the misfortune of running into some very brutal comments from many a Jeep owner. Some warm up after they see how it wheels but it can then sometimes be to late. True colors. :-/ Kinda sad but a lot of Sami groups havent been to excepting of the Geo either.  :'(

 But on the upside times are a changing and I run into those types of comments far less than I used to.  :-/

Mike
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: wildgoody on February 02, 2005, 01:01:15 PM
Hey, I forgot to post this I think,
but about a month or so ago a
Jeep guy gave me a wave as he
passed by, and it was ALL of
his fingers too  
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: tracker8wr on February 02, 2005, 01:01:18 PM
i can't really say i hate jeeps because i have one sitting next to my geo in my driveway.  granted it is not a cheerleader wrangler, it is a cherokee, and it belongs to my wife, for now.  when i get a hold of it, i will make it trail ready. 37's, 8.0" suspension, dana high pinion front for 9" rear, locked at both ends, full exo cage, and when i get the cash a supercharger.  you know, just the basics.

ther just isn't enough room in a geo for 2 kids, a wife and myself that is not including the dogs ( great dane and maltese) what about GEAR


p.s.  i will bring my own winch.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: 90Stomper on February 02, 2005, 01:13:18 PM
i dont dislike jeeps or their owners, my brother has had 4..... keeps going through them so fast....
plus i really like that little square window, and when you want to see out the front it nicely folds out of the way.... LOL

but seriously, in my case i do feel a mix of jelously and pride at the same time.  you can find after market jeep stuff falling from the sky!  most (all?) trackick/sammy owners have had to fab, claw, fight and beg to get their rigs to where they are.  so yes, when a jeepy looks down his nose at me in his JCWhitney fully modded jeep i am not as patient as i should be.  my bad, i will/should work on that....

8)peace 8)
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: mesjr2004 on February 02, 2005, 01:18:27 PM
Quote
i can't really say i hate jeeps because i have one sitting next to my geo in my driveway.  granted it is not a cheerleader wrangler, it is a cherokee, and it belongs to my wife, for now.  when i get a hold of it, i will make it trail ready. 37's, 8.0" suspension, dana high pinion front for 9" rear, locked at both ends, full exo cage, and when i get the cash a supercharger.  you know, just the basics.

ther just isn't enough room in a geo for 2 kids, a wife and myself that is not including the dogs ( great dane and maltese) what about GEAR


p.s.  i will bring my own winch.




you could probably buy two 4door zooks and build one for the trails for less money than it would take to make your current heep trail worthy ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: DirtDevil on February 02, 2005, 01:38:47 PM
I own a chev, 2 suzuki's and a ford, and drive a jeep now and then, definatly prefer the suzuki's, light, good fuel milage, easy to work on, and tons of possible mods to do, I personally think my LJ80 bush buggy drives nicer then my chev ;D  to bad its not street legal... I guess its all personal preference.. alot of posers drive jeeps around here, put a small lift in and bigger tires, only a few really wheel and build em well, the rest, meh... its a jeep thing I guess ... I think the biggest "battle of the brands" is between toyota drivers and jeep drivers.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Cwkick on February 02, 2005, 01:40:30 PM
Quote
   
 Try going on a Jeep ride in a Geo! Jeeps arent the problem, its the owners. Obviosly not all jeep owners but a hell of a lot of em. Ive had the misfortune of running into some very brutal comments from many a Jeep owner. Some warm up after they see how it wheels but it can then sometimes be to late. True colors. :-/ Kinda sad but a lot of Sami groups havent been to excepting of the Geo either.  :'(

 But on the upside times are a changing and I run into those types of comments far less than I used to.  :-/

Mike


I run around with the guy that bought my old Sami and his still gives me trouble about driving a girls Jeep!

Cwkick
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: HotRod on February 02, 2005, 04:13:50 PM
Jeeps. The other white meat ;D
Okay, back to basics.
I have a 2dr, Yes its a little small.
answer.
Bought a 4dr ;D
The Suzukis are just the Perfect size for wheeling.
Check out the 2004 Ultimate Adventure.
Its really what ever floats your boat.
I dont hate'em, I've wheeled with them and I even work with some (3 jeep).
I haven't ran into an A-hole yet.
Guess I've been lucky ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: ningram1 on February 02, 2005, 07:05:08 PM
Here in the UK we have a similar problem with Land Rover owners ???

Can't work out why they hate us so much ???

Bit of a generalisation I suppose, but there you go...

Cheers

Nick
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: ed oorklep on February 02, 2005, 10:21:15 PM
Quote
Here in the UK we have a similar problem with Land Rover owners ???

Can't work out why they hate us so much ???

Bit of a generalisation I suppose, but there you go...

Cheers

Nick


That's the case over here too (Holland) but I have a Land Rover owner in my school and we go wheeling together every now and then, mostly I win on maneuvrability and stuff but his is tax free  ;)
But I havent been laughed at that much mostly people watch first and then are amased  ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: adamd on February 02, 2005, 11:36:12 PM
I don't hate them, I just hate when my urine splashes off them and hits my pants.  ;D

In all honesty, I would have bought a Jeep and was looking for a Jeep when I stumbled across my current Sidekick.. I though the sidekick was a lil anemic in stature and researched a few lifts and saw some lifted Kicks online. I said cool! Sold...  My father, Who has a 8" lifted Grand Cher does'nt know why I bought the "FagKick"  ::) So I do get a lot of whistles and teasing but you take it with a grain of salt. I like my kick, I know what it's capable of offroad, which is damn good considering we have about 6% of the aftermarket support Jeeps do... ::)
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Zukipilot on February 02, 2005, 11:38:41 PM
I dont dislike any vehicle, it's tha owners that can be a pain in the ass. I get comments all the time and the usually (90% of the time) come from Jeep owners. From "that will never make this trail" to " why the hell did you build that" ect...

I love being different and that means doubt from others about what I'm doing, and that is fine. It's the rude asses that I hate. Usually they are the newbies in a new stocker TJ or a slightly lifted Jeep that I can run circles around all day and even after showing them up on the trail they STILL have the attitude. Vetrans of the sport with their experiance and well built trucks usually realize tat each person/vehicle combo has it's advantages and sits back to see how they will do. But even they will look at a Kick in a staging line for a ride at a big event and comment that my Kick will be the one to hold the group up >:(

But then again some jeep guys are OK. I was ordering my new rims form a club members shop when they were power packing a Dodge PU. The owner of the PU asked what I drove and rolled his eyes when I told him. The cool part was I just looked at him like he was a dumbass and the guys working there started defending my ride 8) (Yep, they are both Jeep owners)

Zig
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Bobzooki on February 03, 2005, 12:45:40 AM
When the Gnewt rolls through town, I see Jeep owners getting whiplash, as they turn their heads, trying to figure out what the heck it is.  I mean, one day, I had a girl in a well built Wrangler pass me, slow down, pass me again, slow down again, and pass me again, just scoping the Gnewt out, and trying to figure out what in blazes it was.  It's gonna get even more interesting, when I "re-badge" it as a Land Rover Mystery 30.  Then I'm gonna pull it into the Land Rover dealer, and ask for a factory air filter, and see what happens!
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: adamd on February 03, 2005, 01:16:18 AM
Quote
When the Gnewt rolls through town, I see Jeep owners getting whiplash, as they turn their heads, trying to figure out what the heck it is.  I mean, one day, I had a girl in a well built Wrangler pass me, slow down, pass me again, slow down again, and pass me again, just scoping the Gnewt out, and trying to figure out what in blazes it was.  It's gonna get even more interesting, when I "re-badge" it as a Land Rover Mystery 30.  Then I'm gonna pull it into the Land Rover dealer, and ask for a factory air filter, and see what happens!


Got any pics of your zuk?
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Suzuki1.8 on February 03, 2005, 01:36:22 AM
Quote
i can't really say i hate jeeps because i have one sitting next to my geo in my driveway.  granted it is not a cheerleader wrangler, it is a cherokee, and it belongs to my wife, for now.  when i get a hold of it, i will make it trail ready. 37's, 8.0" suspension, dana high pinion front for 9" rear, locked at both ends, full exo cage, and when i get the cash a supercharger.  you know, just the basics.

p.s.  i will bring my own winch.

you sure you want to put a 8 inch lift  on a unibody ride? Have you ever ridden in a long arm cherokee? My friend owns one not only do 37s still rub unless you hack the fenders away but there street abililty is gone.

As to this jeep war. The biggest problem I have with jeeps. I own a wrangler a sidekick and 67 Bronco. My Bronco is kind of like a Suzuki when it comes to building, while it has more help with after marked parts. When i am in moab and i break something if i don't have a spare unless i brought a extra part. My weekend is done. Or if i do find it , break out the wallet cause it's a million dollars. were as i break something on my jeep 50 people have spares and are welling to give them to me if not free for cheap.

But you guys are missing the whole point as why you build a offroad machiane whether its a jeep, suzuki, hell even a kia. IT's about the love of outdoors and the thrill of making  it. I would also say friendship. Who out there that when he or she has broke down or get stuck any passer wheeler will help you out whether you in a ford dodge jeep or suzuki.  That is the point. The rest is just braging rights to justify how you spent you money. ;)
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Suzuki1.8 on February 03, 2005, 01:39:52 AM
Quote


Got any pics of your zuk?

Hey go to this posting it has pictures of his zuk http://www.zukiworld.com/cgi/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=suzuki_talk;action=display;num=1105656074;start=30
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Bigzook on February 03, 2005, 01:47:33 AM
I had a guy in a stock land rover country tell me it would out wheel my little red zook. I then preceeded to pass him on a narrow trail where he was just doin the 1 wheel peel. I have had problems with not only jeep owners but any 4x4 posers. Like someone said the vetrans usually respect my ride and ask questions. The Newb's diss and laugh.....untill I pass them in a zook on 30's
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Bobzooki on February 03, 2005, 02:23:12 AM
Quote


Got any pics of your zuk?


Click on the thumbnail for the full-size pic.

(http://img209.exs.cx/img209/1884/upabigstep27ri.th.jpg) (http://img209.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img209&image=upabigstep27ri.jpg)

Before Belly Armor:

(http://img238.exs.cx/img238/2401/gnewtinsnow9uz.th.jpg) (http://img238.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img238&image=gnewtinsnow9uz.jpg)

My friend Elaine has a well-built TJ on 37's.  We wheel together a lot.  That thing is HUGE compared to the Gnewt!  When she has to squeeze between trees, I drive through, like it's an 8-lane super-highway.  Once we swapped rigs.  EEEEEEK!  The HOOD on a Wrangler is almost as big as the Gnewt!
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: tracker8wr on February 03, 2005, 03:01:32 AM
i mentioned earlier that i own a jeep and cought flac for it but i don't see many trac/kicks around that can do this

(http://rustysoffroad.com/media/suspension/xj/twisted01.jpg)

granted with a sas and an engine upgrade a four door trac/kick would go places i couldn't but then we would have both spent about $3500 on our rigs and now cost isn't an issue.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: 1bigtracker on February 03, 2005, 05:51:45 AM
Quote
i mentioned earlier that i own a jeep and cought flac for it but i don't see many trac/kicks around that can do this

([url]http://rustysoffroad.com/media/suspension/xj/twisted01.jpg[/url])

granted with a sas and an engine upgrade a four door trac/kick would go places i couldn't but then we would have both spent about $3500 on our rigs and now cost isn't an issue.

3500 bucks!  DAM!  I only have a little over 1500 in my tracker!  wonder what i could do with an extra 2 G's :D

whats the specs on that thing?

stu
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: tracker8wr on February 03, 2005, 06:17:58 AM
ur telling me that ur tracker can pull a 1200 + rating on an RTI ramp maybe if it was a pro-rock class rockbuggy with $8000 IFS and $8500 IRS that would be possible.

Look guys i'm not dogging kicks for god sakes i wheel one. for the price of wheeling a moderatly built trac/kick u can't beat it. there just isn't much after market support for our rigs. there for we are left to create and make our own stuff. ask mike how much he has in his kick becasue that is what it takes to wheel an ifs with 35s reliabe operation.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Suzuki1.8 on February 03, 2005, 06:26:22 AM
Correct me if i'm wrong but that jeep looks as to have coil over  shocks. which by no means are cheap and  bolt on.  And a lift from sky jacker 8inch with long arm travel isn't cheap either. Plus it takes some good long work and modifaction to put on.  And some of the best most built rigs are not in fact after market bolt on parts but home made mods. Even in jeeps case the one that do the best are home grown to say. And the reason there are so many modifactions to jeep is someone started making there own parts and friend said hey that is cool can i get one. I rarely see in competion a rig that is no more then a moon buggy with a fiberglass look a like a jeep or suzuki.  So it comes down to it's not what you buy. But what you build.  Nothing is cheap.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: Suzuki1.8 on February 03, 2005, 06:32:52 AM
oh and think about the cost of drive shafts and axles that will hold up to that big of tires? Last time i checked a custom made drive to allow that much flex is well over a grand. I am by no means saying don't buy a jeep and modify it. I own a modifed jeep and a very modifed bronco. And one thing i learnd is they are by no means cheap. 67 bronco 7 inch supension lift 3 inch body 37 inch tires custom dana 60 axles. tom woods drive shafts atlas 2 transfer case 5.0 fuel injected corba engine custom c6 transmission ect ect.  point in case whether it be a sami or jeep both are going to cost money to get that much flex and make it work.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: tracker8wr on February 03, 2005, 06:33:37 AM
check out these lifts at this site. it is all bolt on.

http://rustysoffroad.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=rustys&Category_Code=S


Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: ningram1 on February 03, 2005, 06:58:37 AM
'Scuse me for going back to Land Rovers.....

I always wondered why they such a bad reputation for buid quality. I found out recently.

The owners (Ford) wanted better quality - they wanted to scrap the quota system in the Solihull plant.

Yep they still operate a quota system. Chap comes to work, is told that he has to attach 50 thrust grabbers to 50 parping couplets. Once he has done them he goes home.
And they wonder why they aren't built very well....

The unions said no. Ford said "we may move production elsewhere" - big hoo haa, you can't mess with tradition etc etc. Even the Landie enthusiasts rallied against the proposal......

Cheers

Nick
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: trackermad on February 03, 2005, 07:30:33 AM
I love my orphan rigs.  Part of the fun of building my rigs has been figuring out how to make stuff work.  But lets not kid ourselves by saying there is no aftermaket support for our Suzukis.  There are some great products out there.  Next time your feeling down about not being able to get the part you want try and find me the clutch slave I need for my 65 Scout.  I drive a Jeep every day to work and its nice to walk into the parts store and get the part I need right away but for my trail rigs its fun to problem solve to get them working the way I want.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: tracker8wr on February 03, 2005, 08:17:52 AM
i used to own a 72 IH pickup with a 345 4 barrel, locked front and rear, dana 44 front, and dana 60 rear and it was a beast. i found most the parts i needed at NAPA. if u need help with some parts i have some friends that r still running thier HI's. i wish i still had mine. thier was a guy in washington state that has the blue prints to alot of HI stuff and can fab parts it wasn't much more than tne prices in the stores.


sorry a bit off topic.
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: 89sami97jeep on February 03, 2005, 12:04:56 PM
alright guys im sorry to get everyone "rilled up" but i have to say you all have an equally good point. as my self i look and laugh at all of the "cookie cutter" jeeps out there.(the ones mommy and daddy bought) i look at them and boy are they decked out: winch, offroad lights, rocker guards,diff guards,bumper/tire carrier,35's  you name it they got it but the funny thing is there aint a drop of mud on'em or a scratch for that matter. and i just have to chuckle a bit (as i drive by in MY jeep muddy,scratched,leaking un-known fluids,parts sometimes falling off) and say to my self I am glad i wheel and work on my own rigs. i hate to see a vehicle with such good potiential just go to waste :'(   as for the attitude thing i "jeep wave" at all things 4wd its just a common courtesy i guess. nobodys rig is perfect there will always be somebody out there over the rainbow with one just a little better........ ;D
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: mesjr2004 on February 03, 2005, 01:02:24 PM
ya it amuses me when other brand oners look down their noses at my zook,and its not just heeps its almost everything,but when it comes down to wheeling dollar for dollar my zook always gets the respect it deserves and has never dissapointed
and i love driving somthing that is always underestimated
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: kansascitytracker on February 03, 2005, 01:20:52 PM
Everything in the world has this type of argument...... Ford vs Chev, Vikes vs Packers, Red Sox vs Yankees. Opinions are like a**holes, everyone has one, so no argument will ever be settled. BUT, if we didn't have disparity in this mudball planet of ours, life would be really boring.......
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: wildgoody on February 03, 2005, 02:07:34 PM
Quote
i mentioned earlier that i own a jeep and cought flac for it but i don't see many trac/kicks around that can do this

([url]http://rustysoffroad.com/media/suspension/xj/twisted01.jpg[/url])


Yep, but My SideKick wouldn't have to,
I'd just drive the flat spot in the middle
;)

Wild
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: mineisbroke on February 03, 2005, 02:19:43 PM
Quote
Yep, but My SideKick wouldn't have to,
I'd just drive the flat spot in the middle
EXACTLY WHAT HE SAID

I have had 4 TJ's and loved all of them . the smallest ran 38s .Chicks dig the jeeps when i am out crusing but when i go to the woods i will take my zuke any day because as much as i like going to the woods I LIKE TO RETURN HOME EVEN MORE !
Title: Re: why all the hate?
Post by: wildgoody on February 03, 2005, 02:32:20 PM
EXACTLY WHAT HE SAID

EXACTLY WHAT HE SAID

[shadow=red,left,300]EXACTLY WHAT HE SAID[/shadow]

(http://wildcatent.freeyellow.com/red.gif)

;D

Just playing with the different fonts