ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: jamescraft34 on February 23, 2007, 03:47:11 PM
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Hello,
I was wondering what might be the problem...
Today when I put my Tracker in 4x4 I noticed I wasn't able to climb anything and my front wheels didn't want to move?!
I can feel the 4x4 engage and I double checked that the hubs were locked but nothing.
I am not a mechanic by any means but I tried a few tests to try and troubleshoot the problem. Any advice would be awesome.
Here is what I tried:
In 2wd with wheel hubs in locked position: cv shafts spin, driveshaft doesn't spin
In 4wd with wheel hubs in locked position: cv shafts spin, driveshaft spins
In 4wd with wheel hubs unlocked position: cv shafts don't spin, driveshaft spins
Thoughts?
Thank you!
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have you checked the hubs for breakage?
my 96 went thru the same problem, my hub where not locking up.
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I did some more troubleshooting...
I jacked up the passenger side tire while the driver side was on the ground, locked both hubs and spun the tire - the driveshaft didn't spin
I jacked up the driver side tire while the passenger side was on the ground, locked both hubs and spun the tire - the driveshaft didn't spin
Jacked both tires up, locked both hubs and spun each tire - neither caused the other to spin
I also checked my locking hubs by locking them and spinning the tires while holding the halfshaft with my hand and each time it would spin.
One thing I thought looked funny while I was looking through the Chilton manual was they said you would need to pry the passenger (right hand) halfshaft away from the differential with some sort of pry tool. Not sure if that means the half shaft needs to be tight up against the diff but mine def is not! Actually I am able to move the halfshaft by hand all over the place. I am including a pic below. Could this mean mine is busted? If so one theory I have is the end of the halfshaft has been severed and is sitting in the gears inside the diff while the rod just sits there. Is this possible?
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I think I may have solved this one. I wiggled the shaft back into the diff and it appears to have fit. The tire tests check out now and the drive shaft moves as expected.
Now I am wondering if this may cause the oil seal to fail? I assume a quick fluid check should answer that? Any thoughts?
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It could well cause the oil seal to fail, you should check the level anyway, the front diff doesn't hold a lot of oil. It might be worth pulling that driveshaft and checking its condition, if it has been loose then the splines may have been damaged which could damge the diff.
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Well I thought I fixed the problem, but now it seems the halfshaft keeps popping out like the picture shows...
Is there supposed to be a clip or something that keeps it in place?
Thank you
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Well I thought I fixed the problem, but now it seems the halfshaft keeps popping out like the picture shows...
Is there supposed to be a clip or something that keeps it in place?
Thank you
Yeah, there is a clip that goes in a groove on the end of the shaft. It helps hold the axle in place. When you push the axleshaft into the housing, you should feel the axleshaft kinda "snap" into place.
You might also want to check your CV joints to make sure they move freely...."in and out", not just "round and round". If the CVs are binding and not moving freely, then when your suspension cycles, it could pull the axleshaft out of the housing, even if the clip is on the inner axle.
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I think my CV's are ok.
What does this clip look like and where would I get it? Name?
Thank you
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I think my CV's are ok.
What does this clip look like and where would I get it? Name?
Thank you
Its just a regular wire type circlip, you'll probably find it in the diff. Otherwise try Hawk.
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In the diff? I would hate to have to take everything apart... I guess I am not seeing how this would clip on? Can somebody snap a pic of theirs please?
Thank you
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I had this happen on my '01. The clip actually broke into two pieces. I had to remove the diff to get the pieces out, and then put a new clip on the axle shaft. It is a pain to do this, but I don't see any easy way - maybe somebody else will? Perhaps you could try to fish it out the drain plug (if the clip is broken into small pieces) or the hole that the axle goes in - this would be tough though.
It is a cheap fix, but time consuming. The clip may have just fallen off inside and can be reattached, but I'd buy a new one just in case it is broken like mine. When you remove the axle, it should be very obvious where the clip goes - it is about 1" diameter and fits in a groove in the splined area of the axle that mates with the differential side gears. No special tools needed.
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I wonder if I removed the halfshaft and stuck a magnet into the diff, would it fish out the clip?
I really would hate to take the diff off. Would leaving the clip inside the diff pose a problem?
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Taking the diff (well, actually the third member/carrier) out is not a big deal. Sure, you'll have to unbolt the flange on the driver's side, and pull the inner shaft out of the diff, but then you can just pull the 3rd member, clean everything out, and put it all back together. No great technical skills required.
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In the diff? I would hate to have to take everything apart... I guess I am not seeing how this would clip on? Can somebody snap a pic of theirs please?
Thank you
Here is a pic of the end of the stub shaft that goes into the diff. If you look at the end of it you can see the clip on it.
I doubt you can get a magnet to pick it up if it is in the diff. More than likely, if it has came off inside, it has gotten chewed up by the gears.
As stated, pulling the diff isn't hard. I don't know that it can be done very easily without dropping the complete front housing out...but that isn't hard to do either. Here's how.....
remove........4 bolts in the left side drop bracket, 1 big bolt holding the left side drop bracket to the frame, 3 bolts for the left side CV axle, 3 bolts in the right side axle housing, 2 bolts for the third rear support in the crossmember;
put screwdriver (or other similar flat object) inbetween the right side inner axle and axle housing to pop the inner stub axle loose, drop the complete housing down a little, shift it to the drivers side to fully disengage the right side inner axle, yank the housing forward to pop the driveshaft slip yoke from the tcase (oil will run out of the tcase, unless you have drained it.....alternatively, you can remove the 4 driveshaft to pinion flange mounting bolts/nuts and leave the driveshaft in the tcase), drop the housing down and pull it out forward, remove 4 bolts in the pinion flange (if you didn't before), hammer the left side inner axle out of the housing, remove the 8 bolts holding the third in the housing, pop the third out of the housing, done.....yeah, I've done a few.
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Thanks a ton for all of your guys' help!
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Well I thought the end clip woudl be the solution here but it seems after tearing everything off, the ring is still in place... So what could be causing the halfshaft from staying put?
Above someone mentioned if the cv's are binding that could be a possibility. Here is a picture of the halfshaft. Are both the rubber boot parts cv's? If so the one on the right moves "in and out" but the one on the left doesn't? Are they both supposed to move "in and out" or just one? Both seem to rotate and flex okay...
Any suggestions please:(
Thanks!
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The inner one should move in and out, and round and round, easily. I believe the outer one is supposed to stay in place (in and out wise), and just rotate freely round and round.
Is your suspension dropping down too much and pulling the shaft out?
Once you push the stub shaft into the differential, how hard is it to pull out?.....You should have to pry it out with something (like a screwdriver) it shouldn't just "fall" out or you shouldn't be able to just pull it out....the clip should be bigger diameter than the end of the axleshaft, and it will compress when you push the axle shaft into the carrier, then it will "spring" open to hold the axleshaft in.....if that makes sense.
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I am able to pull on the shaft by hand with a light tug and it pops out. I guess the ring is the correct size because it must have been the original? I also ordered a new one from Hawk and tried it but had the same results.
Could it be I am not pushing the shaft far enough in? I push with all i have and it feels like it is in place?
I am curious if the rings I have need to be even bigger? They appear to barely be larger than the splines... I attached some pics
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I can't really tell from the pics. If the ring fits down in the groove all the way around the shaft, then I would say it is too small. The one I have, probably sticks out about an 1/8" on one side, when the other side of the ring is pushed down into the ring groove. If I remember, I'll measure one of the rings and post up its diameter. Was the new ring and the old ring the same diameter and stiffness, when you squeezed it?
IIRC, the space between the green part of the CV shaft and the diff. housing should be about 1/8" (just big enough to get a flat blade screwdriver in, to pop the shaft out).
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Seems my rings are okay cause I get the same amount 1/8th when the ring is pushed in. I am wondering if I should wrap something around the shaft in the grove like a piece of wire and install the ring so it sticks out further?
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No. It sounds like your rings are ok. How is the gap between the green part of the CV and the housing, when the axleshaft is pushed all the way in?
As I asked before, is it possible your suspension is drooping too far sometimes and pulling the axleshaft out? It looked like in some of your pics, you are running something other than a stock setup.
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It seems the gap is okay but I wil check again tomorrow. I am running a Calmini 2" susp. lift. I wouldn't think it would do that though?