ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: Lindenmooch on March 24, 2009, 02:22:37 PM
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I bought heavy oil for the Trans Am because it doesn't maintain a good oil pressure.....but I am trying to sell it...and I don't even want to change the oil.
So can I put the 20W-30 oil in my tracker? I don't know the difference in thickness.
I also have a bottle of Lucas heavy duty oil stabilizer to throw in also.....will it be able to crank the engine over at least for the summer? It'll need to be changed again before this winter anyway, so I can go back to the 10W-30.
Feel free to explain what those numbers mean...if you know it.
Thanks dudes. ;)
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20W-30 is some kind of special oil must be. Never saw one with such spec in my country. The temp range is very narrow. Such oil should be put into diesel engine power plants or smthing alike. Why gues? I would go for good 10W-40 or even 5W-40/30.
For example I drove and drive 5W-50 on all my cars, maybe a bit too much for Sammi but... Full synt is full synt, engine is satisfied so as me.
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YES you can.
But I dont reccomend it.
ESPESCIALLY if you live in colder climate, thats just asking for a disaster.
Bryce
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Correction...it's NOT 20w-30....its 20w-50.
Almost 40 views and all I got was a "yes you can but i don't recommend it". This doesn't exactly help me guys.
I don't understand the difference in oils....from 5w to 20w....and the stuff after the "-".
Where are all the pro's??? I thought this would be an easy answer....something that comes with age, and wisdom. A young pup like me has plenty more learning to do.
I have a 5 quart jug of Castrol 20w-50. Can I put it, and a bottle of lucas oil stabilizer, in my tracker for the spring/summer?
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no dont put in your tracker unless you have a diesel engine in it .. id recommend 5w30 with your lucas ... 20w30 is for diesel engine like excavators.tractor trailers .dozer etc.. its for an engine that runs hot and is always in hard work .. so if you like your tracker put 5w30 or 10w30 with your lucas .. and lucas i can tell you its worth it
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I run 20-50 in my Sammi year round, then again I live in Ca. If you are in a colder climate you may want to run a lower viscosity oil like a 10-30, you will have easier starts and better MPG.
Norcal
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Motor oil is very misunderstood, and a lot of misinformation is thrown around. Most important factor for motor oil is flow, at start up and operating temperature. Most engine wear is done at startup, and before engine and oil reach operating temperature. The closer the oil is to recommended flow rates and non operation temperatures the better. Contrary to popular belief a 0w oil is best, like a 0w-30. On that read the first couple chapters.
http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/anything-about-alfa-romeos-alfabb-com/144149-new-great-lengthy-oil-discussion-ferrari-chat.html
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in michigan putting 20w -50 or the lucas is going to cause problems the oil &addiitive ar so thick that they dont flow thru the oil pasages especially on cold mornings friend put lucas in his sami since it smoked a little & the cam siezed I used the lucas in my chevy no problems but would not use it in a engine that should run the thin 5w-30
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0W is not always better choice, there is a parameter in engine such as termal gap(or expansion clearance). Newer ones (somewhere from year 1995 and on) got little gap and require more flowy oils like 0W or 5W to operate properly, older engines gap is bigger so they were designed to work with 10W and 15W grades. But, it is not good to fill in 0W-30 hi-tech motor oil into an old weared out engine, first - it will leak out through o-rings and gaskets once it get hot, secoond - it won't make stable oil film on working surfaces over a big termal gap.
20W-50 is good for hot climate only. Is it synt or mineral?
First index with "W" shows us lower operating temp or winter index, minimum temp when oil is still liquid, all simple: take for example 10W, index is 10 then 10-35=-25 it is lowest temp in Celsium when this oil still liquid. Secoond index shows higher temp operation ability, the higher that index the hotter this oil can be without reducing it's unctuousness properties and viscosity (unctuousness = it's oilnes).
Just that simple. ;)
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Alright, good work fellas. I'll go get some 10W-30 this weekend and change it.
Thanks!!!!
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There are so many different ideas about what oils to run a person could get dizzy from all the conflicting information. Personally I run thicker oils in my vehicles. I have run 20 50 in lil Suzy since about 93, I bought her in 91. I also always run synthetic oil.
First let me say that I am not a novice at this. I grew up around cars, my uncle who owns an automotive machine shop, where I worked while I was in High School, built and raced stock cars for many years. I built and raced hot rods from the time I got my license until I was in my late 20's.
Here is why I think thicker is better.
First, as was stated earlier most wear does happen at startup. The idea that you want a thinner oil so that it will pump the oil to the bearings faster is a flawed idea. First the oil pump will pump any weight motor oil at the same speed. An oil pump is a gear pump and it is going to move the same amount of oil whether it is 0 30 or 20 50. as a mechanical device it can not change speeds and does not bog down because the oil is thicker.
Second, Thicker viscosity oils stay in contact with the wear surfaces longer than thinner oils. This is what you want, You do not want to have the oil pump quickly push oil to the bearings, you want their to be oil already there to lubricate the bearings until the oil pump oil gets there. Also, you want the oil to stay in the oil gales so the oil pump only needs to pressurize the oil which is already there instead of having to pump the oil up out the pan.
Third, When you are working an engine as hard as we are these little Suzukis under high torque conditions a higher viscosity oil will protect bearings better than a thin oil which can allow the crank to contact the bearings in high stress situations. There is a huge difference between the stress on an engine leaving a traffic light and what it takes to force a tire up the side of a 3 foot boulder.
While I am on this kick, (pun intended) stay away from standard multi weight oils. first of all an oil, say 10 30 is suppose to be 10 weight when it is cold and 30 weight when it is hot. This is not physically possible. The actual numbers are closer to 18 22. The reason that the oil thickens at all when it gets hotter is because the formulation contains a form of synthetic rubber molecule which expands as it gets hotter. The problem with this is that these molecules turn to carbon if they are heated above about 300 degrees. This means that if you have a coolant problem there is a good possibility that you will ruin the engine. This will not happen over night but the carbon which is now in the engine circulating with the oil is just like sand paper. it will get into the rings and bearings, valve train etc. and cause major wear. The only way to get rid of carbon in an engine once it has been overheated with conventional multi weight oil in it is to tear it down and completely clean it. This means stripping it down to the block and having it run through the hot tank at your local automotive machine shop.
Synthetic oils use a different chemistry to achieve viscosity change so it will not carbonize when it is heated. Although for the record it does not change the actual viscosity much either.
Lastly if you look in your owners manual you will find that 20 50 oil is recommended for a Suzuki 1.6 8V engine down to 30 degrees F. I run 20 50 year round in lil Suzy and have not had any troubles. I live in Colorado so there are some cold days. When I crank her the oil light is out by the time she fires so I know there is lubrication getting to the bearings. I am also confident that the thicker viscosity oil is staying on the oil rings and not running back into the oil pan, providing cylinder lubrication at startup.
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I change oils with the seasons, 5-30 in the winter, 10-30 most of the time and
20-5 0 in the hot summer, the best oil is a single weight, 30 or 40 or 50, the problem
is the pumping of cold oil, I agree with all of what Sidekicks said, except the oil pump
performance part, cold oil does not pump as easy, and can cavitate (sp) in the pump
causing air to get into the oil when cold. Multi-weight oils were invented for your
wife who has the car going 50 MPH 10 seconds after it's started. single weight oil is fine
if you let the engine warm for a few min before driving
Wild
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I post this link all the time.
Set aside an afternoon, and dig.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php
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I agree with all of what Sidekicks said, except the oil pump
performance part, cold oil does not pump as easy, and can cavitate (sp) in the pump
causing air to get into the oil when cold.
I agree with wild that an oil pump will work harder pushing a thick oil than it will a thin one, This was not my point. An oil pump if it is in good condition will pump both oils at the same speed. It can not do anything different unless the pump fails.
I also agree that cavitation is possible, and one of the things which can cause it to happen is pumping oil which is too thick for the pump to handle. I do not believe that 20 50 synthetic is thick enough to cause that. Having said that I don't think I would try using 50 weight conventional oil during the winter. The only reason I believe that it is safe to run 20 50 synthetic is the better flow properties of synthetic oils.
If your oil pump does start to cavitate you will know it. The pump will make an ungodly racket. I have heard it described as like knuckles cracking, only really loud.
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I am running 5w-30 currently. I still have some cold mornings 10-20 degrees or so. But I am burning a bit of oil. If I run thicker oil, 20w-50, will it burn less since it is thicker.
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I am running 5w-30 currently. I still have some cold mornings 10-20 degrees or so. But I am burning a bit of oil. If I run thicker oil, 20w-50, will it burn less since it is thicker.
The short answer is yes. The long answer is depends. Is the oil problem leaky valve seals, or worn rings?
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I never had an oil problem. It seeps a little at the valve cover...but I can fix that.
I just had a jug of 20W-50, and needed some info about it...and was wondering if I could/should use it.
I returned it at Wal-mart, and got 10W-40 + lucas heavy duty oil stabilizer. I changed it this afternoon.....then immediately went wheeling. =)
I sank the tracker pretty good....*glug glug*. The belts are howling a little...but it runs like a champ. I gotta get a snorkel though!!
Thanks for all the info guys! I appreciate it greatly!
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I've run the Lucas Oil Stabilizer in both my Harley and my Zuk at every oil change. The Harley Gets 20/50 synthetic Moblie 1 for air cooled v twins. The Zuk always gets 10/40 Moblie 1 and Lucas too. Both engines look new inside, always turn over fine, and both get run pretty hard. That Lucas stuff is pretty good, and really does stick to the parts. Just try disassembling a motor after you've used it!
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You guys are missing a major point about oil, they are all meant to run at a certain temperature, and once they reach that temperature their viscosity changes A LOT from what it is when you poor it in the engine generally to all about the same, as does its flowing characteristics, if anyone took the time to read that article you would see what i'm saying. Also, when metal heats it expands, if your get blow by, its more prevalent when the engine would be cold, like people with bad rings, once the engine warms up fully (and actual operating temperature not when the needle says the engine is warm) you'll get less blow by.
Thread on Yotatech.com very good discussion
http://www.yotatech.com/f116/oils-10w40-10w30-159736/
original article, its easier to read because of format.
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/faq.php?faq=haas_articles