ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: djlantis57 on May 25, 2009, 11:25:30 PM
-
Hello, I tried searching for thie topic but no luck so far. I hope someone can provide some helpful information or a link to a topic that can help me. I don't know if this is "normal" or not, as this is my first Tracker i've had...so I can't base this off of experience...
2 things:
1) when starting the engine in the morning, it idles very fast, at about 3,000 RPM and slowly dwindles down to a reasonable idle just below 1,000 RPM. In my opinion, the engine is "dry" (all the oil has settled) in the morning, so wouldn't you want it to idle slower to warm up, instead of going from 0 to 3,000 RPM instantly??? Or is that just the way the engine, ECU, and car are designed, to have a "fast idle" setting in the computer?
2) has a K&N intake tube and filter. When I turn on the parking lamps (not even the headlights), there is a lot of engine noise coming through from the open filter. This noise also occurs when the engine is warm (after driving it several miles in city traffic), and intermittently when the throttle is pressed. Basically, when it is under load: the parking/headlamps (electronic load via the alternator), when it is warm (clutch fan puts a mechanical load), and when the throttle is pressed (a direct mechanical load on the engine). The noise sounds like a giant air pump, that is the best way to describe it.
HELPFUL INFO: 1990 Geo Tracker, G16A 1.6L I4 8v EFI, 5spd, air conditioning
I would GREATLY appreciate any info on these two things. Otherwise the car is going to a mechanic to have it checked out, and maybe install a larger alternator for more charging power, as a lot of lights will be added to this car soon. Thanks guys!
-
1) All gasolene engines have a cold start mechanism that enriches the mixture (for easier starting) and raises the idle (to reduce stalling), so what you describe is, to some extent, normal, although 3000 rpm sounds a little much - I would guess that most vehicles it's between 1200~1800 rpm.
2) If you're using a K&N filter element in the original filter box, the intake noise should not be any louder than with the standard filter - however - if you have replaced the original intake, with a K&N intake then it will be noticeably louder - one of the functions of the original intake is to silence the induction noise. This is pretty much a live with the noise situation - or - reinstall the original air intake.
-
Fordem---THANKS.
1) That's my idea. Every car has this function, but I don't like how my car goes from 0 to 3,000 RPM when it is cold. That CAN'T be good for a cold engine. I have actually found a few topics on here about "turning down" the fast idle setting. Will be looking into it shortly.
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=9551.0 (http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=9551.0)
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=4014.0 (http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=4014.0)
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=46.0 (http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=46.0)
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=4141.0 (http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=4141.0)
2) so it seems. I can live with the noise, and yes, it is a K&N filter with an aluminum intake tube, so I know noise will be louder. Actually, when I bought it, the girl gave me that K&N that she bought for it, but removed it because she said she had a lot of engine noise, and put the stock tube and box and filter back on. I reinstalled the K&N cause i figured "Hey, what's a little engine noise vs. having a superior air filter?" And I don't remember hearing the noise in the first week that the OEM intake was installed (i drove it home 20 miles that night).
-
There is a cold ilde valve on the back (firewall) side of the throttle body. We had an issue on BRD HNTR's Tracker where it would make noise if the heater fan was turned on.
As a test we ended up just clipping the wires, and it ran fine without it attached and fixed the high idle problem. We ended up fixing another issue, but I don't think we have re-connected the idle valve yet.
-
There is a cold ilde valve on the back (firewall) side of the throttle body.
Thanks Drone637, I will look into this. The noise is natural, I guess, but the high idle at startup is the main thing I am concerned about now. What does this cold idle valve look like? Can you send me any pictures at all? I will look for it to try to find it myself still. I'll post a reply after I check for it.
-
Sounds like what happened to my 1.6 8v Tracker. There was a real audible clicking noise when I turned on the fan. The offending solenoid is on the right side of TBI inlet (as you are looking from front of car). I unplugged the plug shown and noise stops, warm low idle also drops to about 300 rpm. I cut the wires shown and noise went away, mileage dropped 1-2 mpg. When checking out other issues I found that the air flow channels under the tbi were plugged. I have cleaned the buildup and replaced the tbi base gasket, but the noise is still there. Check your vacuum hose to distributor to see if it has any vacuum.
(http://lh4.ggpht.com/_86HP5-adsWc/ShyG1T1OceI/AAAAAAAADjE/qcNu4HfctDY/s640/CIMG3427.JPG)
I have not pursued it further because with wires clipped it runs ok, and I have a BIGGER motor to replace it with in near future.
-
Thanks BRD HNTR that helps a lot. I tried unplugging that smaller plug shown (before I got your picture just now) and with that smaller plug unplugged (the red, and yellow two-wire plug), the tracker wouldn't kick over.
I located what I think are the two idle adjustment screws on the backside of the throttle body. I have included a picture, and this is what I think: someone let me know if I am incorrect here. The three things with "???" are the things in question: by looking at it more extensively, that is my assumption: will adjusting one of those two screws bring the cold idle down? I realize it needs a higher idle when "cold", but my cold idle is WAY TOO HIGH at 3,000 RPM. Just wanna bring it down a bit, not eliminate the cold idle altogether.
I unplugged the plug shown and noise stops, warm low idle also drops to about 300 rpm.
And BRD HNTR, I unplugged that larger plug, and the idle dropped a lot the next time I started it. Is there anything wrong with doing this? Could it cause any problems?
PIC DOESN'T WORK WHEN IT'S SMALL...CLICK ON IT FOR A LARGER VIEW SO YOU CAN READ MY WRITING
-
Try this for idle adjustment
http://www.kick-fix.com//IDLE-AIR/dutycycle/idle-setting.html (http://www.kick-fix.com//IDLE-AIR/dutycycle/idle-setting.html)
or this
http://bbs.zuwharrie.com/content/topic,31656.0.html (http://bbs.zuwharrie.com/content/topic,31656.0.html)
I think it has to do with the noisy air solenoid valve, as it was idling just fine before the noise began. I tried lubing the noisy valve and did not change. Also I have been running about for at least a month with the wires cut. Other than the slight drop in mpg, I have not seen any problems. But you know there is one.
-
BRD HNTR, I unplugged that connector earlier with no problem, with it dropping both the cold and warm idle. But I tried unplugging it later tonight and it ran but then threw the check engine light on the instrument cluster. So I plugged it back in and fooled with the screws a bit more...
Actually I took a wild guess and kept playing with those two screws I pointed out in the above picture. I figured that the one on the bottom is the warm idle, the one at the top, the "kicker" that adjusts on that vacuum diaphragm, is the cold idle setting screw. I toyed with it for about an hour, starting it up, letting it run for 5 secs, then shut down (to keep it as cool as possible...since I am trying to adjust the COLD idle). Got too warm, so I started toying with it just now as I was pulling it into the driveway...my earlier settings from the afternoon were great, but it idles down too low and was choking itself and dieing at warm idle. SO turned up the warm idle, down on the cold a bit more, and got it to start, it revs to about just below 2,000 RPM, then idles down to about 1,000 RPM, then once it is warm, the noise goes away and it holds a smooth idle at about 700-800 RPM. SO I am leaving it for morning as it is 1-AM Fresno time, and I live in a city neighborhood...and I am confident it will work a lot better. Before, it used to start and climb to 3,000 to 3,500 RPM immediately upon startup...so 2,000 might be a little high still but better than 3k+ rpm. I'll post a reply after the "cold" morning startup.
-
So adjustment of idle screws got the solenoid to stop cycling? Let me know if that works, I can solder my wires back together. Did you use the instructions I linked? Which one?
Going to wait a bit for engine swap (still missing a few parts).
-
I'm wondering if the fast idle at start up isn't a wax pellet issue ????
-
BRD HNTR, I did not cut my wires, and I am not sure what noise or which solenoid you are referring to.
This morning I got in to start it and it started and revved to 2,500 then dropped and held an idle at abotu 2,200 or 2,300 RPM. Definitely better than 3,500 RPM upon startup.
I am going to let it sit for a few hours now and turn down the cold idle even a bit more still. I've got work to do...might install that front receiver hitch on my truck in the meantime... ;D