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ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Technical Discussion - Performance / Modify => Topic started by: explosivo on May 10, 2005, 09:04:04 PM

Title: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 10, 2005, 09:04:04 PM
Mike, have you gotten any further on those adapter/spacers for Toyota lockouts that you mentioned?

Also, will the Toyota CV shaft fit into the Trackick knuckle without modification? Do you have to have the front widened to allow the larger Toyota CV's to fit, or are they the same length as stock Trackick? So, if one were to do a Toyota IFS swap, the only thing one would need for the front end is the differential, CV shafts, and lockouts, right?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 11, 2005, 07:03:39 AM
Actually 37Kicker is working on it. He made spacers to adapt toy cvs and lockouts to fit into a stock tracker diff and knuckle.  He has them done now. They are a tight fit and some trackers will require to be widened. 37Kicker (Stan) has had a modified version of this kit in his rig for a while now and it works great. If you want more details try PMing him. he usually checks in here once a day.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Cwkick on May 11, 2005, 07:06:28 AM
Hey explosivo,

You thinking about dropping the SAS idea and going to a stronger IFS set up??

Cwkick
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Bobzooki on May 11, 2005, 09:12:44 AM
Quote
You thinking about dropping the SAS idea and going to a stronger IFS set up??


I know I am!  Got my Toy Axles & Lockouts coming on Friday - time to send money to Stan!!!
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 11, 2005, 09:39:49 AM
Quote
Actually 37Kicker is working on it. He made spacers to adapt toy cvs and lockouts to fit into a stock tracker diff and knuckle.  He has them done now. They are a tight fit and some trackers will require to be widened. 37Kicker (Stan) has had a modified version of this kit in his rig for a while now and it works great. If you want more details try PMing him. he usually checks in here once a day.

Mike

Cool, I'll drop him a line... I just remember you posting about it ;)



Quote
Hey explosivo,

You thinking about dropping the SAS idea and going to a stronger IFS set up??

Cwkick

For now... there's a few issues with steering and the likes that I'm a little wary on... plus I don't feel like tossing out my perfectly good 3" Calmini lift for half the price I payed for it ;) I guess I'll just put the Cruiser axles in the back of the garage and wait until I have the money to do an SAS right. :)
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: cj on May 11, 2005, 11:10:31 AM
This is good news. I take it that these are now ready? A couple of questions that I and I guess others would like to know the answers too.

Will this work on a stock setup? Any mods?

Will this work on the Calmini 3"? Any Mods required ?

Will this work on the widened Calmini 3"? Any mods required?

What model/year parts do we need to source? Any mods required?

Cost of spacers?







Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: safarikick on May 11, 2005, 12:14:20 PM
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=318480 :o
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 1bigtracker on May 11, 2005, 12:45:00 PM
Quote
[url]http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=318480[/url] :o

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:DStu :D


Edit: Toyota Hilux?  do they make those in the US?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: chet on May 11, 2005, 02:25:50 PM
yep a hilux is just a foreign term for pick up!  ;D prob anything from '86 to '95 will be what he used. toyota guys throw the stuff out so it should be easy to find. gear sets are cheap as well.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on May 11, 2005, 04:05:32 PM
to answer your ??'s  it will fit stock type tracker susp. w/ some mods, you must widen front end like mike does, a little clearancing on spindles&you must cut & weld adapter flange to the stub side.i have one in a kick with a 13/4" spacer lift now works great. i am installing them in a cal mini lift shortly but at most ill have to widen front. the should be bolt in a kick w/ cal mini lifted veh. w/ the anvil with spindle clearancing. donor 88 toy pu. ifs& style 4 runners. the thing is you can find the parts any where no custom shafts.cost is $300. plus shipping. you supply cv's & lockouts    hope this answers your ??'s       thanks for your interest     stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 11, 2005, 10:33:47 PM
Care to go into detail on this: ' a little clearancing on spindles&you must cut & weld adapter flange to the stub side"

Preferrably with pics ;)
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: brlj on May 12, 2005, 08:57:14 AM
Quote
Care to go into detail on this: ' a little clearancing on spindles&you must cut & weld adapter flange to the stub side"

Preferrably with pics ;)


I was wondering about that part also!!
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 11:14:13 AM
On the back/top side of the spindle about 1/8 inch of metal needs to be ground off about 1 inch long. When you slide the toy shaft through the spindeit will be clear where to grind. If your not running the Anvil the stub shaft on the pass side will need to have the toy flange welded on. The same as the widen artical but use the inner flange he provides.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 12, 2005, 11:19:20 AM
Quote
On the back/top side of the spindle about 1/8 inch of metal needs to be ground off about 1 inch long. If your not running an anvil the stub shaft on the pass side will need to have the toy flange welded on. The same as the widen artical but use the inner flange he provides.

Mike

So wait, the adapters that are being made are to mate yota CV's to an anvil? I thought it was going to be the whole front assembly (including yota diff housing)... ???

My questions are all aimed towards making the CV shafts work with the Tracker knuckles (ala the pirate link posted above)... so to do the swap (diff and CVs), all I would need is the spacer for the lockouts, correct?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 11:21:54 AM
Quote

So wait, the adapters that are being made are to mate yota CV's to an anvil? I thought it was going to be the whole front assembly (including yota diff housing)... ???

No, you use the diff you have. You do not need an Anvil. An anvil would make it easier but not neccicary.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 11:24:56 AM
Honestly swapping the toy diff into the front has never crossed my mind. I do not know what that would entail.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 12, 2005, 11:27:16 AM
:-/
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 11:34:02 AM
Quote
[url]http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=318480[/url] :o



This is not the same thing. This does look interesting but not the same.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 11:35:15 AM
Quote
:-/

???
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 12, 2005, 12:00:46 PM
Quote
???

:P
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 12:06:24 PM
Quote

:P

::)
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 12, 2005, 12:07:42 PM
 ;DIm smiling cause I have no idea whats going on! ;D
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 12, 2005, 12:09:52 PM
;D I'm smiling because I'm going junkyard hunting tomorrow, and then I'll find out how feasable the Toyota IFS swap is for myself ;D
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Zukipilot on May 12, 2005, 12:58:24 PM
Quote
;D I'm smiling because I'm going junkyard hunting tomorrow, and then I'll find out how feasable the Toyota IFS swap is for myself ;D


Dude, talk to mike and stan and get some details about stans set up. It's awesome!!! He hammered the &*^&^ out of it all weekend and the IFS Kicked ass 8) Definately worth the work ;)

Zig
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on May 12, 2005, 03:15:15 PM
thanks for answering those ??'s for me mike  ;D i got in late, more r&d on new projects. i dont have any good pixs yet. hope mike answerd ??'s if not get back to me. stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: whitfield on May 14, 2005, 01:44:41 AM
You guys are making my head hurt again  ???.

1. Widen front end.

2. Clearance the spindles (Top to fit)

3. Pass side stub will need to have the toy flange welded on.

4. Drivers side stub will use a bolt on adapter?

5.  Install 86 & up CV's with shafts (Right on right / Left on left?)

6.  Use Toyota IFS Lockouts  (Is the Suzuki & Toyota Asian lockout bolt pattern the same)?


Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 14, 2005, 02:08:08 PM
Quote
You guys are making my head hurt again  ???.

1. Widen front end.

2. Clearance the spindles (Top to fit)

3. Pass side stub will need to have the toy flange welded on.

4. Drivers side stub will use a bolt on adapter?

5.  Install 86 & up CV's with shafts (Right on right / Left on left?)

6.  Use Toyota IFS Lockouts  (Is the Suzuki & Toyota Asian lockout bolt pattern the same)?


Questions 1-6 = yes ;D

Mabey Stan can verify this but i belive toy shafts are the same length on both sides.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: whitfield on May 15, 2005, 12:47:22 AM
Thanks!     ;) 8) :D ;D


Quote
Honestly swapping the toy diff into the front has never crossed my mind. I do not know what that would entail.

Mike



THe IFS Yota front diff is big, heavy, and ugly.  Mine also has the center vacuum disconnect.   It is so big I'm not sure their is room.   A hybrid Hilux rear center up front would probally be easier.  
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on May 15, 2005, 12:05:12 PM
the toy cv's are the same length. you need toy lockouts because the outer axle stub is bigger. i thought of the toy diff. but the gear selection was limited.        stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Natebert on May 15, 2005, 12:46:27 PM
Quote


Dude, talk to mike and stan and get some details about stans set up. It's awesome!!! He hammered the &*^&^ out of it all weekend and the IFS Kicked ass 8) Definately worth the work ;)

Zig



I don't know.....  

I saw Stan pull Ross's Sammy and the front wasn't even on the ground.  How cool can a suspension be when it isn't even on the ground half the time?

;D

~Nate
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on May 16, 2005, 12:17:18 AM
I'm struggling with the terminology here. When you say Lock Outs do you mean what we call Free Wheeling Hubs? If the outer stub axle is the bit that slides through the hub into the Free Wheeling Hubs is bigger (diameter?) then do you have to change the front wheel bearings too?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 16, 2005, 09:58:14 AM
It sounds to me like what you call a free wheeling hub is what we call a lockout. The wheel bearings do not need to be changed. the axle fits through the spindle.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Bobzooki on May 16, 2005, 10:02:44 AM
OK, Mike, I have the axles, and the lockouts, and just sent Stan the money for the adapter.

Do I HAVE to do the widening mod, or is that optional?
Do I have to grind anything away on my rig?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: cj on May 16, 2005, 01:02:07 PM
Quote
I'm struggling with the terminology here. When you say Lock Outs do you mean what we call Free Wheeling Hubs? If the outer stub axle is the bit that slides through the hub into the Free Wheeling Hubs is bigger (diameter?) then do you have to change the front wheel bearings too?


Rhino, freewheeling hubs and lockouts are the same thing.

The following is from an article on Aisin hubs (source forgotten)
".....many of the parts are interchangeable between hubs from differing vehicles. For example, you can use a junkyard hub from a Toyota for parts to repair a Suzuki. .........The Suzuki and 30-spline Toyota hubs are virtually identical except for the inner hub. The grips on the dial of the 30-spline Toyota hub stick out slightly beyond the cap, where on the others, it is flush. Functionally, the dials are interchangeable between the Suzuki and 26- and 30-spline Toyota hubs. The 26-spline (IFS) Toyota hub has a deeper backspacing between the mounting flange and the inner hub than the other hubs, in order to clear the spindle nuts. Because of this, the Suzuki or 30-spline Toyota hub body will not fit on an IFS toyota wheel hub, but the reverse should work; i.e. a 26-spline Toyota hub body should be usable on a Suzuki or 30-spline Toyota hub. "

Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on May 16, 2005, 05:21:01 PM
Bob you will need to clearance the back side of spindle slightly, I have not got the anvil yet to trial, it should bolt in.  thanks   stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: cj on May 16, 2005, 05:39:30 PM
Bob, take pics please and do a write-up as I'm looking at this for mine with a 3" Calmini suspension.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 1bigtracker on May 16, 2005, 10:58:29 PM
Quote
Bob, take pics please and do a write-up as I'm looking at this for mine with a 3" Calmini suspension.

YES! PLEASE
stu
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 17, 2005, 02:35:56 AM
I second pics and writeup! Lots of pics, pretty please ;)

On the topic of swapping in the whole front differential: gearing shouldn't be a problem, as I was doing fine offroad with the 5.12's, so 5.29's (or whatever they are... can't remember off the top of my head) would be great... a little lower, and still strong enough to keep the R&P from being my weak link.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: sergi on May 17, 2005, 05:20:30 AM
Wow, this is interesting...
I would really like to do this, can anyone think of a reason why this couldn't be done on a GV?
I would think it would be mostly the same though you never know.
By the way, when you say "widen the front end", in how is that done? Would it simply be moving the spindle outward or possibly moving the whole A-arm out?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on May 17, 2005, 05:17:20 PM
it should work on a GV. to widen you move the rear part of the control arm out wards 3/4"-1"  stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: sergi on May 18, 2005, 04:09:44 AM
OK, thanks a lot. I'll investigate further, I am very interested!
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: blacknight on May 18, 2005, 05:46:50 AM
You may not need to widen on the GV's as the cv/ axle shaft are a little longer.  Also you will need to lose the shift on the fly and go to man hubs for this.
George
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: explosivo on May 18, 2005, 09:02:51 AM
Quote
you will need to lose the shift on the fly and go to man hubs for this.
George

That's a good idea if you're going for strength, anyway, no?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on May 19, 2005, 12:12:42 AM
Quote
You may not need to widen on the GV's as the cv/ axle shaft are a little longer.  Also you will need to lose the shift on the fly and go to man hubs for this.
George


Why do you need to loose the shift on the fly? It is all contained in the diff. I don't think it weakens it at all. It is a pretty tough looking assembly
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: blacknight on May 19, 2005, 12:39:10 AM
Quote


Why do you need to loose the shift on the fly? It is all contained in the diff. I don't think it weakens it at all. It is a pretty tough looking assembly


Never mind you don't have to replace the shift on the fly stuff.  I was thinking that this was a striaght swap in and splins wouldn't be long enough to work with this set-up. After rereading all of the post that doesn't seem to be the case.
George

Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: kozaz on May 19, 2005, 08:38:06 AM
Just adding some more info on (Modified) Toyota IFS CVs and shafts.

The following images show a Toyota CV Joint and Axle with a 930 CV joint with adapter installed.  The images came from http://www.brian894x4.com.

This 930 is stronger and replaces the inner cv joint, I'm just not to sure if it improves axle travel, I believe it's for a strength upgrade.  Keep in mind the axle may have to be replaced to match the new 930 splines.

(http://www.brian894x4.com/Porschecvjoints.jpg)

(http://www.brian894x4.com/backsidecvjoint.jpg)

(http://www.brian894x4.com/completedaxle.jpg)



Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: cj on May 19, 2005, 10:46:53 AM
Yep, the 930 also improves travel as well as strength and you can pick 'em up for $50
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on May 19, 2005, 02:19:31 PM
 those look tuff but ive not broke the inner cup (yet im still trying)  that joint is only $50 ?  it gives me more ideas.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on May 19, 2005, 04:38:53 PM
Quote
those look tuff but ive not broke the inner cup (yet im still trying)  that joint is only $50 ?  it gives me more ideas.

Think of the angle you could run.

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: ksa421 on June 02, 2005, 08:17:31 AM
http://www.off-road.com/toyota/projects/tacoma/cv_axles/

(http://www.off-road.com/toyota/projects/tacoma/cv_axle_update/images/19_cvaxles.jpg)

(http://www.off-road.com/toyota/projects/tacoma/cv_axles/cv_axles_fullsize/cv-axles-3.jpg)

What about centering thhe diff and running those axles...

Has anyone ever delt with these guys?

ftp://http://www.cvunlimited.com/
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: ksa421 on June 02, 2005, 08:22:10 AM
I just found this place too...

http://www.rcvperformance.com/products.html
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: SiKiD_01 on June 02, 2005, 06:48:11 PM
Quote
[url]http://www.off-road.com/toyota/projects/tacoma/cv_axles/[/url]

([url]http://www.off-road.com/toyota/projects/tacoma/cv_axle_update/images/19_cvaxles.jpg[/url])






now that is the angle of the dangle we want! someone make one for the track-kick now too please.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on June 03, 2005, 12:00:13 AM
Quote



now that is the angle of the dangle we want! someone make one for the track-kick now too please.


Doesn't look to be a lot of travel in that shock though. I guess it is mounted a bit in board though.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Fredo on June 03, 2005, 03:13:48 AM
Check this! :o

(http://www.trailslesstraveled.com/content/techarticles/60/1_cvr_animation.gif)

Fredo
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 1bigtracker on June 03, 2005, 04:09:17 AM
Quote
Check this! :o

([url]http://www.trailslesstraveled.com/content/techarticles/60/1_cvr_animation.gif[/url])

Fredo

no shock...

stu
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on June 03, 2005, 11:33:40 AM
It looks like you could get that with the shock. Its not easy to scale it without the measurements but it looks like it would go to the bumpstops. I'd be happy with 12" of travel on the front of my Vit.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: SiKiD_01 on June 03, 2005, 04:36:01 PM
if only we could. i love to have that set up in my vit, and if i had enough money for that set up, i'd buy a mint condition vit just to put it in!

i dont think we can get more than 8" travel with a strut set up in our vits. even if we took the shock (strut) off our front arms, the range of movement wouldnt be as much, as the CV would bind and resist any more movement, and the ball joints also.

with the ball joint, when lifting, its at a bad angle already, and when further droop is needed, it will bind bad, or pop out. similar to the rear a arm ball joint. thats why we need spacers.

we've all got vits that sit pretty high and all, but sacraficed is front ifs travel. with the yota set up, we can still have the hieght, and even higher, but also with the travel to match.

*drool*dream*drool*

maybe one day it'll become so popular that it'll be a kit conversion. i'd stay ifs for sure, even though i am already.

oh yeah, imagine the clearance under the front end with that set up. 35" tyres easy ay?

(sorry, my post does not contain much useful or tech related info, i am just very excited about having a set up like the above in my vit.)
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on June 04, 2005, 09:46:08 AM
Quote
we've all got vits that sit pretty high and all, but sacraficed is front ifs travel.


I'm not sure I understand what you mean by that. The stock travel on the strut is around 4", adding 2" strut spacers free up 2" of unused strut travel giving around 44% more travel than stock. Drop the diff and add OME struts and you have 7.5" of strut travel. I've no idea what that is in terms of wheel travel but its nearly a 90% increase.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on June 05, 2005, 10:01:57 AM
I keep looking at that. When you look closely the diff must be much lower than on the Zuk as the CV goes up a long way from horizontal, on a stock Zuk it only goes horizontal. It would be easy to get loads more travel from the Zuk by chopping the crossmember and lowering the diff a lot but the you would lose ground clearance.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: cj on June 05, 2005, 10:37:06 AM
The other thing to note is that it is a centered diff with longer axle shafts so you will get more travel at the wheel without any increase in angle at the inner CV. This can be done on our rigs as Mike has proven but it's not one of the simpler mods to do.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: SiKiD_01 on June 05, 2005, 03:33:55 PM
Quote


I'm not sure I understand what you mean by that. The stock travel on the strut is around 4", adding 2" strut spacers free up 2" of unused strut travel giving around 44% more travel than stock. Drop the diff and add OME struts and you have 7.5" of strut travel. I've no idea what that is in terms of wheel travel but its nearly a 90% increase.


ok, when i read back over my post, it doesnt seem to make too much sense.

but with my vit now, the front wheel, when measured from the outside of the rim to the guard, has about 4" up ward movement, and 4" down ward movement. so i think its safe to say that the front of my vit sits almost halfway on the strut stroke.

BUT...

on flat level ground, you can see that my CV shafts are not level, or parralel to the ground, but on a downwards angle.

anyway, like rhino said, our vit diffs sit a fair bit higher than most other ifs rigs, and thats where we suffer. less travel for more ground clearance. i know that i have been saved many a times from the front ground clearance, so it would be a shame to loose it. but then by lowering the diff, you could gain more travel, and maybe a higher ride height.

sorry if you cant understand me, i keep seeing the animation above, and get lost in a world of dreaming.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on June 05, 2005, 03:42:13 PM
The strut is still only so long. So if we were able to make more travel then make it up travel and all is good right. ;) Probabally have to cut the fender a bit though ::)

Mike
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Craw4x4PH on June 05, 2005, 08:07:40 PM
Enough with the IFS ground clearance silliness! ;D :P Check this out, this is a friend's project Land Cruiser http://www.pbase.com/drexx/was_fzj80_of_amando_mendoza

Then view how he reincarnated the wrecked LC (if you're interested) http://www.pbase.com/drexx/ultimate80_2004

But what I really want to show you guys is this: his Humm9 axles. Solid axles with high ground clearance: http://www.pbase.com/drexx/image/27395462

Just sharing :)
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: SiKiD_01 on June 05, 2005, 09:59:31 PM
Quote
The strut is still only so long. So if we were able to make more travel then make it up travel and all is good right. ;) Probabally have to cut the fender a bit though ::)

Mike


ok, maybe i cant get this around my head right, but having more up travel would almost be the same as the equivalent of down travel, right? pros and cons of course.

now, ground clearance. i have lots, i think, but that is with a stiff-ish coil and coil spacer. now if i were to keep this clearance and have more up travel, would i not need a longer and softer coil?

like, its the coils job to give the suspension lift which results in clearance, usually from a longer or stiffer coil, but it also has to be soft enough to allow for the wheel to move upwards the desired amount. so its gotta be soft too.

now if you have a long coil, and a soft rate, at some point not near ideal, the coil can bind up and not reach potential due to lack of room or space in the front suspension set up.

so how can we make the front tyre touch the underside of the bonnet, and also keep our ground clearance? will the answer be in the struts?

sorry to be so ignorant, but i still cant see a total fix/mod for the front end of a vit. (compared to the yota set up)
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: ed oorklep on June 05, 2005, 11:17:05 PM
I think you'd need more space to install the longer coil in the front, so your upper coil cups should move upwards too, otherwise the spring would be fully compressed at a point not that high.....  :-/ So a lot of modding would be needed to get more uptravel  :-X
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Charlie on June 05, 2005, 11:21:19 PM
“ok, maybe i cant get this around my head right, but having more up travel would almost be the same as the equivalent of down travel, right? pros and cons of course.�
Sure that the way a solid axle works. Looking at the rear one side goes up as the other droops down but IFS just isn’t designed to work that way, I don’t believe you gain much having more untravell because your losing groung clearance in the middle.

Regards Charlie
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on June 05, 2005, 11:58:31 PM
Quote
sorry if you cant understand me, i keep seeing the animation above, and get lost in a world of dreaming.


I'm having the same problem, lol. I keep thinking about a Toyota hub somehow attached to the stock lower wishbone with a fabricated upper arm, doing away with the stock stut. The problem is that there isn't any more down travel in the CVs. The whole issue becomes a ground clearance/travel argument. You could get 16" of travel if you really wanted to but you would have to drop the diff 8". As much as I like that set up I think my current set up is the best all round compromise keeping IFS. I haven't really had any driveshaft problems but I like the idea having the extra strength of the Toyota shafts
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on June 06, 2005, 12:04:45 AM
Quote
on flat level ground, you can see that my CV shafts are not level, or parralel to the ground, but on a downwards angle.


To try and clarify what I meant. If you take off the spring and jack the wishbone up the then with the wishbone against the bump stop the shaft is pretty much level (no diff drop brackets) so for the whole of your 8" of wheel travel the driveshaft only travels downwards. Therefore you could lower the diff 8" or whatever and the driveshaft could then travel up and down.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Pablo Toledo on January 11, 2009, 07:03:43 PM
Hello everyone;

Let me introduce myself. My name is Pablo Toledo and I'm from Brazil.

As owner of a 93 Vitara with some improvements, I'd like to have further detailed information about swap the stock Vitara's CV and half-shafts to Toyota's IFS one.

I tried to contact Mr. Hagen twice, but unfortunately he have never reverted to me.

Thank you all in advance for your attention.

Best regards,

Pablo Toledo
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Zukipilot on January 12, 2009, 06:12:47 AM
Hello everyone;

Let me introduce myself. My name is Pablo Toledo and I'm from Brazil.

As owner of a 93 Vitara with some improvements, I'd like to have further detailed information about swap the stock Vitara's CV and half-shafts to Toyota's IFS one.

I tried to contact Mr. Hagen twice, but unfortunately he have never reverted to me.

Thank you all in advance for your attention.

Best regards,

Pablo Toledo

Pablo,
PM Stan (user name: 37Kicker) and let him know you are interested in his conversion kit. They (Mike and Stan) do not get on line as much as some of us so it may be a few days before Stan contacts you.

Zig
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 4Zstracker on January 12, 2009, 07:49:45 AM
Just a question;

So, if you need to Widen the front end of your Trac/Kick for this Toyota CV mod, Could you get the same result by using a taller lift spring ( like the zukination 4" ) and just not lowering the dif at all?

What about their crazy control arms, would they help making it long enough perhaps?

That Toyota joint should give enough travel with Trac/Kick struts to be just fine, I would think.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Pablo Toledo on January 12, 2009, 12:49:52 PM

Pablo,
PM Stan (user name: 37Kicker) and let him know you are interested in his conversion kit. They (Mike and Stan) do not get on line as much as some of us so it may be a few days before Stan contacts you.

Zig
[/quote]

Hi Zig. Thanks for your reply.

I sent a message regarding the matter to Stan on Dec 29, but unfortunately he have never answered to me. That's why I'm tapping the forum looking for further info on the CV's swap.

Pablo
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Zukipilot on January 12, 2009, 02:30:49 PM
I believe that a search for toyota CV will give you most any info you need. The next time I speak with Mike I will ask him to let Stan know you are interested in his conversion.

Zig
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Rhinoman on January 13, 2009, 04:22:12 AM
So, if you need to Widen the front end of your Trac/Kick for this Toyota CV mod, Could you get the same result by using a taller lift spring ( like the zukination 4" ) and just not lowering the dif at all?

Using longer springs and not lowering the diff isn't very practical, the angle of the CVs would be very poor.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Jeremiah on January 13, 2009, 10:09:36 AM
I sent a message regarding the matter to Stan on Dec 29, but unfortunately he have never answered to me. That's why I'm tapping the forum looking for further info on the CV's swap.

Pablo

I've sent him messages with no response as well  :'( I'm beginning to think we need to find another way to get Toyota CV to work. What about swapping the whole Toyota dual A-arm front, and installing a matching Toyota rear axle? It would open up a LOT of diff gear & locker options, get a wider stance, get the strength of Toyota bits.... Is it still a strut setup with dual A-arms, or does it go back to shocks & springs?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Pablo Toledo on January 13, 2009, 05:47:54 PM
Pablo
[/quote]

I've sent him messages with no response as well  :'( I'm beginning to think we need to find another way to get Toyota CV to work. What about swapping the whole Toyota dual A-arm front, and installing a matching Toyota rear axle? It would open up a LOT of diff gear & locker options, get a wider stance, get the strength of Toyota bits.... Is it still a strut setup with dual A-arms, or does it go back to shocks & springs?
[/quote]

Jeremiah, you might wanna take a look at the link below. The guy is running ok with 38".

http://www.foo.is/gallery/toydrivetrain

Pablo
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on January 13, 2009, 06:19:52 PM
Hello everyone;

Let me introduce myself. My name is Pablo Toledo and I'm from Brazil.

As owner of a 93 Vitara with some improvements, I'd like to have further detailed information about swap the stock Vitara's CV and half-shafts to Toyota's IFS one.

I tried to contact Mr. Hagen twice, but unfortunately he have never reverted to me.

Thank you all in advance for your attention.

Best regards,

Pablo Toledo

Pablo, I think your mistaken. You contacted me by pm once and I responded. ??? I wish I hadnt just cleaned out my pms a week ago or Id cut and paste it here.  I belive I sent you to 37kicker. I talked to 37kicker last week and he said he had been corresponing with someone from Brazil. I would assume thats you.  Do you know how to check your PMs?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Pablo Toledo on January 13, 2009, 06:33:04 PM

Pablo, I think your mistaken. You contacted me by pm once and I responded. ??? I wish I hadnt just cleaned out my pms a week ago or Id cut and paste it here.  I belive I sent you to 37kicker. I talked to 37kicker last week and he said he had been corresponing with someone from Brazil. I would assume thats you.  Do you know how to check your PMs?
[/quote]

Hi Mike, thanks for your reply.
I do know how to check my PMs but apparently messages wasn't delivered in my inbox. Also, I'm not the one ho is in talks with Stan. Anyway, it is not a big deal at all.
As I mentioned in my previous posts, I would like to get further information (and pics would be great) about swap the stock Vitara to Toyota's IFS one. I know that there is a lots of info on that here, but as I'm not a native english speaker and I do not know much of mechanics even in portuguese (my mother tongue), many times it is difficult to me understand the solution that you have developed. We can conduct this conversation in PM if you want.
Thanks again
Pablo
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Mikerpm4x4 on January 13, 2009, 06:39:43 PM
I called 37kicker at work. He has not been online for more than a glance in a week or more. You should hear from him soon. Just to be clear, he does this in his free time in his garage. This is not a profesional buisness. He has a full time job working a lot of overtime lately.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Pablo Toledo on January 13, 2009, 06:50:50 PM
I called 37kicker at work. He has not been online for more than a glance in a week or more. You should hear from him soon. Just to be clear, he does this in his free time in his garage. This is not a profesional buisness. He has a full time job working a lot of overtime lately.

I completely understand it Mike. Thank you for let me know.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on January 13, 2009, 06:58:42 PM
 sorry about the wait, its like mike said real buisy with work. there should still be pixs some where on the board. im not very good with computers or posting pixs.the kits are avalible i build them when ordered. my kit containsthe adapters, bushings and spacers needed to install toy cvs and lock outs in a kick.you need to do the hagen widening for this mod. if you have any more ??'s pm me i'll try to check pms more and respond.   stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Jeremiah on January 15, 2009, 07:06:12 PM
I called 37kicker at work. He has not been online for more than a glance in a week or more. You should hear from him soon. Just to be clear, he does this in his free time in his garage. This is not a profesional buisness. He has a full time job working a lot of overtime lately.

I'll keep waiting too...


Tell him to make a bunch in batches, and sell 'em to lowrangeoffroad or something  ;D
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: nova on March 09, 2009, 11:27:21 PM
If it's not patented, I might try to find a machine shop who might cut out a couple batches.  I want to do this to mine and about 10 other rigs I know of, but I have a list of exencive parts that I need before I spend a lot on a kit.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Jeremiah on March 10, 2009, 12:52:52 AM
Still no response to me about this  :-\ I'm thinking of going with a Toy front clip instead  ???
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: nova on October 25, 2009, 10:10:26 PM
Anything new?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Zukipilot on October 26, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Anything new?

If you need info on purchasing this conversion. PM MikeRPM4x4 or 37Kicker. They will PM you the next time they get back on line.

Zig
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: keith on October 26, 2009, 06:55:41 AM
What ever happened to Explosivo (the one who started the thread)?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on October 26, 2009, 10:29:45 PM
my phone #715 377 6993. or pm me ive been trying to get on line more i've been trying to get a different mill programedwith the parts,other one crashed with no luck fixing yet.i am in the process of designing them to fit with out doing the widening. stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: jawman on October 28, 2009, 09:51:02 PM
That is a lot of info to take in. when is some one going to do a build with lots of pics?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: nova on October 30, 2009, 10:07:47 PM
Hey Stan, noticed you were on.  Do you have any of these kits avaliable right now?  Widening it fine, as long as I don't have to cut up 2 more inner shafts and weld them together.  That's why my front isn't widened right now, the 3 3-bolt flanges on the drivers side.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on November 01, 2009, 05:08:34 PM
i'm just finishing up a couple of them this week.the one axle will bolt to the three bolt stock flange, but the short one will have to be cut apart and the toy adapter welded to it. if your interested get back to me.  stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Shadow on November 08, 2009, 11:45:49 AM
Do you have any ready to go? I want to do this to my Grand Vitara :D.
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on November 08, 2009, 04:44:21 PM
currently the kit does not fit in a 99 and up but im looking into making it work for these rigs.  stan
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: Shadow on November 09, 2009, 03:11:35 PM
What needs to be done to make them work?
Title: Re: Toyota IFS (paging Mr. Hagen)
Post by: 37kicker on November 11, 2009, 10:05:28 AM
 the bracket on the short side is in the way of the axle flange.  stan