ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: BarbieTracker on June 14, 2004, 11:58:50 AM
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Ok, I have a 4x4 '92 Tracker. I figured snow and such would be no problem. But, I was out this winter and got stuck in a rut and couldn't get out without a push. I had the hubs locked and the transfer case was in 4 low. My friend got out and looked to see if one of the front tires were turning, but neither were. So the other day I stopped on a gravel road and through it in 4 low again. I wanted to see if I could kick up some gravel and did, but only at the rear wheel, nothing from the fronts. What does this mean?
Here's some more info... in 2 wheel I get going at a speed of about 20K/hour at 3500RPM's and in 4 high, if i remember correctly, its about the same as that... but in 4 low at 3500 RPM's i'm going about 5K/hour... Since I don't really understand the workings of 4 wheel drive and don't know how to interpret this infomation, can anyone explain how the 4 x 4 works? In detail? Please? What I really don't get is how the gearing gets so much lower but the front tires don't spin. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Robert
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sounds like the front hubs are dirty and have
rust in them, they just need a good cleaning,
regrease and reinstall.
One way to check this is to jack one front wheel
up and lock the hub, now turn the tire by hand,
is the shaft turning ? if not, the hub isn't locking
and needs to be cleaned, repeat for the other side,
all it takes is 1 side to not lock and you are in 1 wheel
drive without a rear locker, a 4x4 is really 2 wheel drive
without lockers, or with stock open diffs.
Good Luck
Wild
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i agree with wild or u know the front drive may be gone. i would stick wirh the hubs.
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I guess when you say, "Is the shaft turning?" You mean the halfshaft and not the drive shaft right?
And should both turn, on both sides? Wait, I'll answer that myself... Yes both should turn on both sides... halfshafts that is.
?
Also, what is the difference between 4 Low and 4 High?
Robert
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Yes, the half shaft, but I knew you would
figure it out ;) The only way the drive shaft
will turn is with both hubs locked, turning both
wheels with the T-case in 2 WD or neutral.
Also when you check the other side if the first
side is still locked it would turn the drive shaft
if the hubs were working correctly.
:)
Wild
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HAVE YOU LOCKED THE FREE WHEEL HUBS??
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Have I locked the free-wheel hubs? You guys don't know me, but, I assure you I won't post a question if the answer is that simple (or silly) Yes, I locked the hubs.
Robert
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He said so in his first post, but the result
of sticking hubs is the same as unlocked
Wild
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sorry,just an idea that hit me.
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are they auto or manual hubs??
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i had this same problem when i first took my rig out, it had never been wheeled by the previous owner. i was going up a snowy trail when i got to a point that i couldn't go further. my tires kept spinning. so i told my buddy to get out, and look to see if the front and back tires were spinning. only the back one was, so i asked him to see if the front axel shafts were spinning, and they were. it turned out that the drivers front hub was stuck, a little cleaning and she worked again.
this is a free fix, no parts needed ;)
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Ok, here's the deal... I jacked up the car on the driver side... spun the wheel with the hub locked and the T-Case in 4-low and the halfshaft didn't spin... on the other side it did. So, from what I have read earlier I guess I have to fix the drivers side... I have the Chilton book, it's probably in there... but i'll ask anyways... How hard is it? Is there anything I should know about doing it?
I guess this is worth mentioning also... on the side that works.. when I turn the wheel about and inch in either direction there is a slight click.. not a click really... I guess it was more like a rattle... Is that normal or a sign that it might also be in trouble? Also, if I spin the wheel while the hub is unlocked, then lock it, then spin it again, I can hear it click/engage. I would imagine that would be normal. Alright, I hope I provided enough info and asked enough questions... Thanks Guys
Robert
Oh and yes, they are manual hubs
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That rattle is probably the spider gears
going around, BTW the T-case doesn't
need to be engaged, and if you spin the
wheel with it not engaged the rattle would
probably stop.
The hardest thing is the springs inside the
hub, if they get off the knob are hard to
get back into place, just a little funny not
overly difficult, pay attention as you take
it apart, I don't think the springs need to
come off, it's usually rust or goo on the
splines that lock the hub to the axle.
Wild
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Hey Wild,
I just read the book on it and it says "install a 'new' O-ring" Do I have to? I will do it right now if I don't need that O-ring
Robert
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if the old one is OK your good to go,
it goes between the hub lockout and
the wheel hub.
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BarbieTracker, about where are you located? Someone here on the list may be a neighbor and could spend some time with you to explain the mechanicals of your Tracker.
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I am in Surrey, BC Canada
Robert
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i think their are lots of people from around their.
stu
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OK Wild, here is where I got. First of all I ditched the book cause I don't think it was necessary or specific enough for my situation.
I pulled the cover off of the hub (6 allan key bolts) I was trying to pull the cover gently off but then it just popped out... I noticed the spring was attached to the hub, well, not anymore :) Then I took off the 6 bolts that hold the hub on... I looked inside it and it was dry/slightly corroded, also a little rusty. So from there after staring at it for a while I decided to clean up the spring and throw some grease on the hub. Not sure where to put the grease on there so I just put it on everything :) haha, really, I did.
Now the problem... like you said earlier, how the hell do you get that spring back on? ! I think I could do it if I were sure of how it went on.... The hub surrounds the axle shaft, but has 2 inner ridges...follow me and see if this makes sense to you... Does the spring wrap around the closest part to the axle shaft or the outer wall of the hub?
I know what I mean, but not sure if I explain it good enough for you... Thanks if you can help
Robert
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the spring presses the collar down to the axle shaft so it hooks to it(best i can explain it). it also takes it back when the hub is unlocked. so it needs to be hook to the pease that moves in and out.
stu
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Ok, I have it on the piece that moves in and out, that is the piece that is part of the cover (the back of the actual mechanism to turn the lock the hubs) it's the other part I don't get, on the spindle... there are 2 spots that it could hook to, do you think it would be easier if I pulled the spring off of the cover and put it on the spindle, then tried to put the spring on the cover again? Is that possible?
Robert
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??? i don't normaly don't rebuild them. just throw them away when they mess up. sorry i can't help.
stu
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Anybody else?
Robert
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I am in Surrey, BC Canada
Robert
i'm in north van.
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Must be nice ;)
Robert
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Anybody else?
Robert
standby
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here download this
http://members.shaw.ca/wintersam/images/AisinHubs.pdf
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Hey thanks alot
That should help make sense of stuff
Appreciate it.
I'll take a good look at it tomorrow, gotta get up and watch European Cup Soccer
Robert
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Ok, I didn't go to bed yet. I noticed in the diagram that it shows a bolt and washer that goes into the end of the shaft.
I don't have that! After thinking about it some more, I don't know if I have that clutch in there either, unless its in the hub, but it's definitely not on the cap. I dunno, I guess i'll have better look at it tomorrow but I remember when I took it apart thinking that it looked like something should be there... Oh well
Thanks again, it's going to be very helpful.
Robert
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OK, see if this helps, you have the hub body (6 cone bolts)
you have the hub cover with the turning part (6 allens)
inside you have 2 springs, and a splined center piece
that hooks to the spring, this part engages the axle spline
piece.
The loose splined part has a groove that goes around it on
one side, this is where the short spring hooks into, Oh also
you have a thin stamped steel thing that goes between the
2 springs DON'T Take It Apart, it's a PITA to get back together
right.
OK the long spring goes next to the turning cover, the 2 tabs that
stick out farthest on the metal thin piece go into the cam groove in
the cap, so as you turn it it moves in and out, also you will notice the
edges of the metal thin piece have like square cut gear teeth around
the edge, these have to line up right with the splined center piece or
it won't work right. The wide spot on the center part, where it looks like
the teeth are missing is where the spring and metal tab go.
The short side of the spring goes around the inside of the center splined
part. This should hold the cap, both springs, the thin metal thing and center
splined part all together. Now look closely at the marks on the hub body,
you should see where the little hole in the cover once was, put the cover
back on in the same position, or the hub won't work right, put in the cone
bolts, and 2 of the hex bolts and test for proper opperation, if it turns and
then clicks to engage and the half shaft turns, it's right, put all the bolts in
and proceed to the other side, repeat the process so you don't get stuck
on the trail somtime in the future.
I hope this is clear enough and not mud
Good Luck
Wild
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FIXED!
After all your help, (everyone that is) including the pdf document, I realised that when I took it off, the center piece or clutch i believe it is, was stuck in the hub - kinda seized. Nothing that two sets of needle nosed pliers and a rubber mallet couldn't get out. I got it out, cleaned it up, put the spring back on it, (which is alot easier to do with the clutch out rather than jammed in the hub) and voila, kickin up dirt with the front tires now.
The only thing is that when I set the hub to free, it isn't disengaging. I imagine that is happening because I put grease on the outer part of the hub splines, I think that was a no-no. So I am gonna clean it up again and it should work fine.
Thanks for all the help guys/girls. Greatly appreciated.
I fully understand how a hub works now.
Robert
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You can't go wrong putting grease on any part of the hub.
Some times the tire has to rotate a couple of times before the hub unlocks.
Now you need to do the other side. It may work now but is likely to cause you problems later.
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grease it all, but don't pack it too much,
just cover all the parts.