ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Model Specific Suzuki Forum => Suzuki Grand Vitara, Vitara, Chevy Tracker (Gen. 2 Platform) 1999-2005 => Topic started by: r3cc0s on September 23, 2011, 06:15:22 AM
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replaced the water pumps, checked all pullies, no issues with oil burning, clutch throwout bearing etc... replaced and good... noise isn't from the fan
But... on my 2.0l, after driving about lets say 20km and the engine is warm, it starts making this rattling noise that comes and goes dependant on RPM...
that being said, it doesn't sound like its from the exahust at all and more like from the valve cover, but I don't think thta makes much sence neither.
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Do you have an oil pressure gauge fitted?
The 2.0 engine uses hydraulic lifters and IF you're losing oil pressure with the engine warm, it might be possible to get some valve train noise.
Please note - the low oil pressure light comes on at something in the vicinity of 4 psi, my 2.0 gives me close to 25 psi at a warm idle - so you could have oil pressure low enough to cause problems without that light coming on - I've made it a point to fit an oil pressure gauge to every vehicle I have owned in the last two decades - and I'm just about to do another install (I have a new to me Mitsubishi Pajero iO)
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could it be a timing chain issue?
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ahh - yes - and that may also be oil pressure related, since the chain adjuster/tensioners are hydraulic - I just sort of expect that to come from the timing cover area rather than the valve cover area.
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damn... i think it is a timing chain issue
intresting thing is, the noise isn't there when its cold... so perhaps the chain expands or the tentioner isn't working
if its just the tentioner is it as much of a strip down job?
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On a 2.0 I think you can get to the tensioners without too much teardown.
Drain the cooling system, saving the coolant for re-use.
Remove the radiator, fan & fan pulley.
Remove the cam cover
Remove the serpentine belt along with the tensioner & idler pulleys - there is a nut behind the idler pulley that has to come off.
Remove the crankshaft pulley bolt & pulley
Remove the front cover - there are two bolts coming up through the oil-pan flange into the timing cover that have to be removed first
VERY IMPORTANT - stuff a rag into the oil-pan opening to prevent any dropped items (such as woodruff keys from the timing sprockets) from falling in to the pan.
It's probably a good idea to rotate the engine until the timing marks line up BEFORE removing any chains, or timing components as this will make reassembly with the correct timing significantly easier.
Let me make it very clear - I have not done this myself - but these are the steps that I think are required, I have been researching it as I plan to go in there in the very near future - and yes - it would be nice if you would "guinea-pig" it for me and let me know what I missed. I have a very light, barely audible rattle from the timing cover area when the engine is cold - it goes away as it warms up, but it's taking longer & longer to go way.
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Everything has to be removed off the front of the block.
The book says to remove the oil pan,just remove the bolts that go up into the timing chain cover.
the timing cover has rtv on it be careful and make sure you have all the bolts out.
here is the Manuel http://pdftown.com/Suzuki-eBook-Category.html (http://pdftown.com/Suzuki-eBook-Category.html)
for a good price for the set https://www.store.partsdinosaur.com/ (https://www.store.partsdinosaur.com/)
http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/suzuki-grand-vitara-vitara-chevy-tracker-%28gen-2-platform%29-1999-2005/timing-chain-32882/ (http://www.zukiworld.com/forum/suzuki-grand-vitara-vitara-chevy-tracker-%28gen-2-platform%29-1999-2005/timing-chain-32882/)
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I'm in the same situation as you Fordem, mine has the rattle sound which goes away after a few seconds of running at start up. I found a complete looking timing chain/adjuster/gear repalcement "kit" on the Rock auto.com site for the 2 liter engines for about $325 (as I recall) that looks pretty complete. Rock auto has some very good prices. Appears to be competitive with what the partsdinosaur offers.
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I'm in the same situation as you Fordem, mine has the rattle sound which goes away after a few seconds of running at start up.
Maybe not - I had that rattle, or what I think was that rattle - a brief, 3~5 second metallic noise, only on the first start of the day - I got rid of it by switching to OEM Suzuki filters, what I have now is a much softer, barely audible, irregular "patter" - used to fade away after 2~3 minutes, takes longer now.
As far as parts go - I've got SGP stuff sitting on the shelf waiting to go - because of my location, it's usually easier (and frequently less expensive) to pickup certain items from the local dealer - if I ordered from RockAuto or Parts Dinosaur, the shipping would kill the savings.
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what is intresting about my timing chain rattle (which I'm certain it is)
its not prevailalnt unless I run the engine hard...
I can drive it for a good couple hours, and as long as the RPM's were kept under 4kish the whole time... no noise
but once it's been rev'd, it sounds very loose... so I'm thinking its more of a tentioner problem than a chain problem, but regardless the whole thing will have to come apart.
I think I may attempt it sometime myself
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That's why I asked about the oil pressure - the tensioners on the engine are hydraulic and depend on the oil pressure.
When an engine is driven hard, it generates more heat and that additional heat is more easily visible as a rise in the oil temperature/drop in the oil pressure than it is as a rise in the coolant temperature - the thermostat regulates the coolant flow to maintain a given coolant temperature.
This may sound far fetched, but I can see the effect of ambient temperature on my engine by the changes in oil pressure at idle - on a hot day the oil pressure at idle is a couple of psi lower, especially during the first hour or so after noon, when the temperatures are at their highest.
I've considered fitting oil coolers but decided it's not worth it given my use of the vehicles - they rarely run for more than 30~60 minutes at any one time - if my "normal" usage pattern involved frequent long trips, I probably would install them.
By the way - what oil are you using? I run a 10w40 - I was a 10w30 but our noon temps here run into the 90's now (climate change) so I've switched.
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relatively thin oil -- which will be fine for the winters...
5w30
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5w30 mobile 1... which is relatively thin
but regardless, its maintenance time :(
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at what time would you guys concider doing the timing chain?
this is intresting... if I don't drive it hard, don't downshift hard... the noise is not very prevelant
however if I do drive hard, big dips and changes to RPM... even at idle I'll hear it rattle
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at what time would you guys concider doing the timing chain?
It's not a maintenance item, so if you don't hear it, don't change it.
The guys I've spoken to say timing chains rarely fail, and they have been very reluctant to go near my engine - mind you I have seen them work on the H series V6s, but even there they don't change the chains, just the guides & tensioners.
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That's a very good point fordem. It is the tensioners and plastic parts in the tensioners that apparently wear quickest.