ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Technical Discussion - Beginner / Repair => Topic started by: Sundance58301 on November 25, 2011, 08:52:55 AM
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My 93' Kick with 1.6 has always idled fast. But now a new
issue.
Just lately after warming up it idles slow (200 rpm) and is
erratic. Like it's going to die.
The MPG has dropped markedly too.
It seems to run fine at highway speeds but I get 22 mpg where
I used to get 30 mpg regularly.
Where to look first?
Thanks
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I would check for any codes, if none are present, check the sensors with a multimeter. If they check out fine I'd suspect the ECM.
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Check the EGR for clogging as well as the cat for clogging too.
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Started it this morning and it went to the usual 2000+
RPM for 30 seconds or so and then dogged down and almost
died.
Then it will smooth out and run OK for a bit and dog. This
repeats.
If it was a clogged converter wouldn't it run like crap all the
time?
I only have an OBD2 reader for codes.
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You don't need a code reader for a 93 (it is OBD1). You just short the "B" and "C" pins in the 4 wire plug up by the battery and then turn the key to run and watch the CEL and count the flashes to determine the code(s).
If you haven't done a tune up (new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, air filter, adjust valves) lately, I would do it. Might also be a good idea to replace the fuel filter.
The EGR passages and EGR valve are bad about clogging up on these engines. So a thorough EGR system cleaning may be a good idea too.
You could also check/replace all the small vacuum lines too. A leaking vacuum line will cause an unstable idle.
The ECMs are known for going bad in these. I had one that would do something very similar to what you describe. It would run fine for awhile (or at idle), but would then bog out so bad that I would hardly be driveable (actually, I couldn't get much above about 25mph). The ECM was bad. Some can be fixed, some can't.
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You don't need a code reader for a 93 (it is OBD1). You just short the "B" and "C" pins in the 4 wire plug up by the battery and then turn the key to run and watch the CEL and count the flashes to determine the code(s).
Thanks I will do this this morning. I assume this will clear the check engine
light?
If you haven't done a tune up (new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, air filter, adjust valves) lately, I would do it. Might also be a good idea to replace the fuel filter.
I just bought it 5K ago and he had done most of this. But I'll give
them a good check, especially the dist cap.
The EGR passages and EGR valve are bad about clogging up on these engines. So a thorough EGR system cleaning may be a good idea too.
I am out of town without my manual. I assume the EGR valve is a
replacement issue? How do you clean the passages?
You could also check/replace all the small vacuum lines too. A leaking vacuum line will cause an unstable idle.
I checked them all, but it is cheap enough to replace them
all. I'll pick the line up today. I have to travel back home Wednesday
morning (400+ miles).
The ECMs are known for going bad in these. I had one that would do something very similar to what you describe. It would run fine for awhile (or at idle), but would then bog out so bad that I would hardly be driveable (actually, I couldn't get much above about 25mph). The ECM was bad. Some can be fixed, some can't.
I am guessing that you replace the ECM after the above it it doesn't
cure it? Are there test for the ECM?
Thanks to everyone who responded. And thanks for a great forum
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No. Shorting the pins in the plug by the battery just allows you to read what codes are stored. The only way to clear them is to either fix the problem, or unhook the battery for awhile. If you unhook the battery, but don't fix whatever caused the code, the code will come back (the CEL will light up again).
I have seen worn (improperly gapped) plugs and bad plug wires cause more running issues than a bad cap or rotor.
To clean the EGR valve and valve passages, I use a stiff wire, brake cleaner and compressed air. You can use a small flat screwdriver on the EGR valve. Just be careful and don't gouge the shaft inside the EGR valve. You can also use a small drill bit, to clean out the EGR valve passage that the large rubber hose hooks to.
The best/easiest test for a bad ECM is to swap in a known good one. Most bad ECMs can be fixed by replacing the capacitors and fixing any bad copper traces. But some can't be fixed (the ECM is damaged beyond repair, the bad components/traces can't be found, etc.) and have to be replaced.
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Does anyone have a picture of the EGR valve and it's placement
on the 1.6? I am several hundred miles from home without my
manual (it will come with me in the future).
When the Kick is idling low it has a sickeningly sweet, rich smell.
Like it's getting too much fuel.
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No pic, but it is on the passengers side rear of the engine.
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I made it home OK.... And now I can slide it into the shop
to work on the EGR.
Got as low as 18 MPG coming home. I had a light trailer on
but it always got 25 to 28 mpg with the trailer.
Hope it's the EGR
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Oh and I ran a bottle of Seafoam through it as well as a quart
of Marvel Mystery oil (not together) and they didn't help the
issue at all.
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What error code did you get from the ECM?
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http://www.kick-fix.com/ECU/ECU.html (http://www.kick-fix.com/ECU/ECU.html)
http://www.kick-fix.com/EGR.html (http://www.kick-fix.com/EGR.html)
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Anyone sell rehabed ECU's?? Beyond what I can do as far
as replacing capacitors etc.......
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Have you been driving my Kick without me knowing??
I'd appreciate it if you fix my problem with it after driving
it.
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Anyone sell rehabed ECU's?? Beyond what I can do as far
as replacing capacitors etc.......
I think Skyhiranger does, or try here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAMURAI-SIDEKICK-SUZUKI-GEO-TRACKER-ECU-ECM-EBX-COMPUTER-REPAIR-SERVICE-YOUR-/390366836093?pt=Automotive_Services&vxp=mtr&hash=item5ae3ad357d (http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAMURAI-SIDEKICK-SUZUKI-GEO-TRACKER-ECU-ECM-EBX-COMPUTER-REPAIR-SERVICE-YOUR-/390366836093?pt=Automotive_Services&vxp=mtr&hash=item5ae3ad357d)
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Anyone sell rehabed ECU's?? Beyond what I can do as far
as replacing capacitors etc.......
I think Skyhiranger does, or try here:
[url]http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAMURAI-SIDEKICK-SUZUKI-GEO-TRACKER-ECU-ECM-EBX-COMPUTER-REPAIR-SERVICE-YOUR-/390366836093?pt=Automotive_Services&vxp=mtr&hash=item5ae3ad357d[/url] ([url]http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAMURAI-SIDEKICK-SUZUKI-GEO-TRACKER-ECU-ECM-EBX-COMPUTER-REPAIR-SERVICE-YOUR-/390366836093?pt=Automotive_Services&vxp=mtr&hash=item5ae3ad357d[/url])
I don't have an ECM that matches what you need, at this point. You can either try getting yours rebuilt by one of the guys on zuwharrie, either Redidbull or Surly, or send it off and see if the ebay guy can fix it. The zuwharrie guys both do great work at a reasonable price. I don't know anything about the ebay guy.