ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Technical Discussion - Performance / Modify => Topic started by: showgun on February 05, 2012, 06:21:35 PM
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I just want to get some info on this samurai setup. I am new to samurai's and haven't seen one in stock configuration. This one has had some modifications done to it and Im trying to figure out whats stock and whats not...
I know the leaf spring mounts are fabricated, do the leafs look to be original or are they a swap?
The leafs look a little flat, should I run new leafs with more arc?
Are the leaf spring mounts in the original locations?
It appears that the front end is sagging a little, I was thinking about getting new leafs and shocks but wanted to figure out what this is set up with. I can take measurements on the leafs if needed.
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3623.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3624.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3621.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3622.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3626.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3625.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3629.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3630.jpg)
Thanks in advance
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Not near stock.
A. It has been shackle reversed.
B. I'm pretty sure those are YJ springs . Stock samurai are 2"wide . those look to be 2.50 YJs.
C. It's got a crossover steer kit on it.
D. your pinion angle is all wrong on the front end.
E. your drive line is in backwards..
All the work , other than the pinion angles and the drive line, looks really pretty well done.
On a SPOA suspension (as you have) you kinda want flat springs, the flatter the better. This promotes good articulation.
Unless the builder rotated your steering knuckles your caster is way off on your front end. This will make it wander.
You should have 3-5 degrees of negative caster angle. Looks like yours a ways to the positive.
You can correct this problem with wedges. MAKE SURE THEAY ARE BOLTED INTO THE SPRING PACKS. Not just slid between the springs and the pads.
A good rule of thumb is that the axle flanges (where the drive lines bolt to the pinion) should be parallel to the flanges on the transfercase. (Boath axles)
I can't see your shocks or mount so I cant comment on them. I will say that with your suspension I'd be running a long travel kit.
I also don't se a rear track bar... If one is not on your Zuke now . ADD ONE . You will need it.
Also, once you have your geometry corrected check your driveline length. You may need spacers.
And last but not least. The slip joint goes towards the transfercase.
What you have is the makings of a great Zuke SPOA suspension. Just needs a little fine tuning...Have fun and welcome to the Zuke world....Boxcar...
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boxcar, You're the man!
Thanks a ton for the info, This is why I posted here... greatly appreciated.
I'll get under it tonight and measure the springs to verify. I'm trying to put together a "parts list" so I can tear into it and put the finishing touches on it. I know the front axle needs rebuilt (seals), needs new shocks (running ranchos with only 5" of travel), needs longer brake lines, plus the pinion angle shift and driveling change you mentioned, no sway bar on the front or back - should I run both or just the rear, and why?
This weekend was the first time I've torn into it, In the process of going through all the wiring, accessory wires everywhere... It was broke into and they pulled the radio face out with all the switches. I've got the winch up and running, the push button starter in order and most of the lighting wires figured out... now it's time for the mechanical piece!
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Yep, jeep springs....
Ive been reading on caster angle vs pinion angle all night and I'm a little overwhelmed. It looks like its in the negative right now judging by the pinion angle. It appears that its a little too negative and could be rotated towards the positive a few degrees if I'm understanding correctly. At what point does someone sacrifice pinon angle for caster on a samurai? If the front pinion angle isn't lined up with the drive line will it be an issue?
If I'm understanding this correctly the negative caster will improve the steering/tracking but will add some stress to the TC seals, pinion seals etc...
Also, I see where the front sway bar has been taken out. I haven't checked the rear but how will adding a sway bar to the rear improve its offroad driveability?
This is a dedicated off-roader - not street legal.
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Took a look at the front axle a little closer... Wanted to see if these welds and the end of the axle housing were normal construction. I'm looking at the pinion angle and then looking at the nuckle and the nuckle and components look to sit flat but without putting a gauge to it my eyes could be off 10 degrees... The spring perches are welded in place to accommodate the pinion angle, no shims being used to achieve the angle.
Any other thoughts on this?
Are the welds below normal for a stock sammy front axle?
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3643.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3642.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3639.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3641.jpg)
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can you take a pic of the other end of the drive shaft, Thank's.
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The sencond and third are of the left side, the 4th is of the right side.
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can you take a pic of the other end of the drive shaft, Thank's.
i was gonna say, the driveline does not look stock either.
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Will get pictures of the drive shaft up tonight.....
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Its got a tracker rear with spool...
The first three are of the front drive shaft and the last three are of the rear.
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3644.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3645.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3646.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3647.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3648.jpg)
(http://i1040.photobucket.com/albums/b404/showgun1_bucket/DSCN3649.jpg)
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Man they sure have those axles tweaked! ...would that allow any fluid to reach the bearings? My drive shafts dont look anything like those from memory... and my rear seems a lot longer.
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Yeah... I wonder if its a sammytracker hybrid rear driveline! Adding fluid to those diffs will be fun, I guess if I keep it on the trails some gear oil might make its way to where its suppose to be!
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The rear should get plenty of oil as it is slug off the ring gear. The front, the opposite is true and should be addressed. Much less the caster angle.
The drive flanges of the axles and the TX case should be parallel in an ideal setup. Pretty much impossible with a 4x4 but the CV joints are a nice touch and can makeup for a lot on the front.
Other than the angles, it looks pretty good.
I might address the rear front spring mount. Looks like it kinda hangs out in the front looking to hook something?
I would cover the splines on the drive shaft that are exposed too. Why pull dirt into there?
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Well I'll probably just run with the rear as is for now because it has the CV joint. After doing some research I think Im going to add a rear track bar. As for the front, I think Im going to buy some shims and try to reduce that pinion angle a bit and put the caster in the negative which will slightly extend the driveline length which will require a spacer which costs more money.... !!! Hope my wife doesn't find these posts, she'll really figure out what I spend on my hobbies...
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Wonder what the cv's are off of.
Ha I used to keep a running total of what I have in my sami... just got too depressing! At least my better half is on board. Heck she wants her own trucklet now!
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Front shock looks like its contacted the spring plate? ..u probably noticed though. Mine did the same thing when I lowered the lower mounts to the bottom of the axle tube. I had enough bolt on my lower mount to shim the shock a bit for clearance. My shocks have different mounts on each end so I wasn't able to simply flip them 180 like I wanted. Im also wondering the reasoning they put such a steep angle on the rear shocks?
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Your rear axle is dangerously over rotated . As you apply torque to it it's going to rotate further up and bind your u joint. (Opposite of tire direction) Looks like the builder was thinking backwards. I see that allot.
I'd highly recommend you look into a better spring perch for your rear springs.
The cv's are a nice touch. Look like early Yotas or jeep Cherokee front cv's...Cool...
The welds on the front tubes look like stock welds. Hard to say though .
With a flat pinion angle .If you draw an imaginary line through the barfield knuckle pins. You should be at 3-5 degrees of Neg. caster on a stock axle. (Top tipped to the rear)...
Sway bars on a strictly off road rig are going to limit your articulation quite a bit. If you never plan on driving it on road I'd loose them all together...
I didn't see a track bar on your rear axle eather. You will need one . Especially with that pinion angle in the rear. WOW.....Boxcar...
PS: The wife thing That's another problem all together . I wish she was as easy to figure out as my wheelers...
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Thanks for all the info guys...
I'll address the axle issues and get those things turned down, Now that I think of it, I heard a clanking while it was under torque which was probably the rear u joint binding up. I'll cut and weld the rear perches to gain the angle needed and I'm going to move the front shock mounts to the top of the spring plate and fab up some bump stops.
As for the wife, She's great. She definitely puts up with my hobbies and enjoys the outdoors with me. Once this is up and running she will see why its worth it...
Thanks again.