ZUKIWORLD Online | Suzuki 4x4 Editorial and Forum
ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Suzuki 4x4 Forum => Topic started by: jerryp58 on April 17, 2004, 10:53:40 AM
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A few months ago I adjusted the valve lash on my 1.6L 8V.
I did a compression test recently and was disappointed to see:
1 -- 170
2 -- 160
3 -- 165
4 -- 60
Yes, 60 :o
I was hoping I did a horrible job of adjusting the valves, but I checked them today and they're all in spec :(
I have no oil on the plug (it's grayish-white) so I guess the rings are OK. I have no sign head gasket leak in the oil, water, or the outside of the engine. All I can think is that I've got a bad valve.
Oh well, I guess it could be worse.
I was going to put a throttle body spacer in but got kind of discouraged; maybe later.
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Where can I get a compression test done? ???
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Where can I get a compression test done?  ???
Any competent mechanic, or get your own compression tester, They're not too expensive.
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If you redo the head (valve job) you need to
make sure the engine is in good shape or it
will only last around 40,000 more miles before
it needs the bottom end done too.
I'd say more than 140-150 K miles and it
will need the bottom end too :( sorry for
the bad news
Wild
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Where can I get a compression test done?  ???
I just have a basic auto parts compression testor (not the leak-down setup). Just pull the plugs, screw in the compression testor, and let it crank a few times. It'll give you a general idea of the condition of the combustion chamber; hopefully, you'll have better luck than I did.
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If you redo the head (valve job) you need to
make sure the engine is in good shape or it
will only last around 40,000 more miles before
it needs the bottom end done too.
I'd say more than 140-150 K miles and it
will need the bottom end too  :(  sorry for
the bad news
Wild
Hey, I'd be thrilled with another 40k miles. Should've stated, it has 150k on it now. No complaints here. For as high as these things have to tach to get down the highway, 150k is pretty impressive.
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A few months ago I adjusted the valve lash on my 1.6L 8V.
I did a compression test recently and was disappointed to see:
1 -- 170
2 -- 160
3 -- 165
4 --  60
Yes, 60 :o
I was hoping I did a horrible job of adjusting the valves, but I checked them today and they're all in spec :(
I have no oil on the plug (it's grayish-white) so I guess the rings are OK.  I have no sign head gasket leak in the oil, water, or the outside of the engine.  All I can think is that I've got a bad valve.
Oh well, I guess it could be worse.
I was going to put a throttle body spacer in but got kind of discouraged; maybe later.
That my worst fear. My friends, who also have trackers seem faster than me either that, I don't push the RPMs that high. I really care about my Tracker and maybe I baby it. Is that sooo wrong?
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I did my top end when I had a burnt valve
at 200,000 miles, it lasted for about 30,000
more before it got really tired, good side
was it only needed rings and bearings to
feel fine again :) well that and a Turbo
;D
Wild
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turbo..drools
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MMMM............ Turbo (http://www.whitepineclub.com/forum/images/smilies/drool3.gif)
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^ hahaha thats great ;D
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A few months ago I adjusted the valve lash on my 1.6L 8V.
I did a compression test recently and was disappointed to see:
1 -- 170
2 -- 160
3 -- 165
4 --  60
Yes, 60 :o
I was hoping I did a horrible job of adjusting the valves, but I checked them today and they're all in spec :(
I have no oil on the plug (it's grayish-white) so I guess the rings are OK.  I have no sign head gasket leak in the oil, water, or the outside of the engine.  All I can think is that I've got a bad valve.
Oh well, I guess it could be worse.
I was going to put a throttle body spacer in but got kind of discouraged; maybe later.
Several things make the compression, the rings and valve is the biggest of them. Try adding some oil into the cylinder and see if this bumps you up some. If it does, then rings could be the problem. I'd also check pcv valve. With compression getting by the rings, it goes into the crank area, thus into the block and heads where the oil has channels to return to the sump.
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sounds like a valve leaking....
a wet test is old school. A leakdown test is more with the times. If you are sure the valves are set right .. any further testing is probably a waste of time tho....
there is a lot of folklore about doing valve jobs on older engines and burning oil ect.
however I have a better method of sizing things up....
If you do a valve job. look at the top of the pistons , if they (ALL) have an even build up of carbon across the top then a valve job is all you need.
If there is a clean area around the perimeter of the piston top. from the edge to Like a 1/8" in, then this indicates oil pasing the rings. properly sealing valves will bring out the oil burning beast in your finished project.
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well, there are oil rings and compression rings
from what i hear, it can have horrible compression but not burn oil, it is 2:50 am and i might not be thinking properly but i think thats right
and 200,000 miles on an engine wild?!?! holy, i would've been so happy with that, up here(in canada) i'd say i see a lot at 200,000kms, and maybe liek 235,000 for the higher end, 200km=~125miles
maybe u guys take better careof your cars :P
Andrew
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It's possible but highly unlikely that oil rings are good and compression rings leak..... unless they are broken in which case you wil have extreme blowby causing oil fowling of the spark plugs and oil washing on the piston tops(from the top down) if this is the case and that is possible with the compression readings listed. it will look pretty oily inthe combustion chamber.
I would add that I have been an auto tech for 18 years and done a lot of heavy duty work (engines internal) but this is the internet and here, everyone is an expert ;)
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Thanks for the info Cowtracker.
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Where does one get a throttle body spacer, or does one have to make one's own?
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Where does one get a throttle body spacer, or does one have to make one's own?
I made mine out of wood, but I think I have one corner of one side not quite perfectly flat. That, and being a little discouraged about the compression, kept me from putting it on yesterday. There's not a lot of room under there. The one I made is about 1/2". I think I could get maybe 3/4" without too much worry of smacking the air cleaner housing on the hood. Now, after a 2" body lift, then I could go 1" spacer, or more ;D
I've never cut or worked with the stuff, but I have thought about buying some phenolic material and trying to make one out of that. I can't remember if I've seen one for sale anywhere or not -- but I don't think so.
BTW, I think I'd see more improvement with my Throttle Body Injection than someone with the newer Multi-Port injection. And imporvement is relative. I'm assuming I'll be pushing the power curve up the RPM scale. Which would give me a little less HP/TQ at the lower RPM and a little more at the higher RPMs. That's fine for me, 'cause most of my travelling is highway.
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I would add that I have been an auto tech for 18 years and done a lot of heavy duty work (engines internal)
Do you guys have anything in the shop (like a light/scope) that lets you see in the combustion chamber (say through the plug hole) to evaluate the rings & valves?
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yes they do make a scope that has a flexible neck for the lense, these tools are pretty spendy$$$! I have always sidestepped the expence,since it is a diagnostic tool and really won't fix anything. it's very dificult to pass these expences on to the customer.
as long as the valves are set properly(you could back off the adjusters 1 turn and retest compression 2 b sure) there is realy no way around pulling the head.
Also: Good news for you spacer makers
aluminum can be cut using the same tools as wood(this includes ALL BUT the cheapest chinese tools)
Aluminum will dul things a bit faster than wood but it works just fine.... cutting oil helps too..
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I've seen wooden TBI spacers before, so I figure that there wouldn't be a problem with the material... A block of aluminum is expensive (lots more than I want to spend ;D). Also, since I might try making a wooden one, is there any sort of wood I should specifically use? Hard, soft, medium?
jerryp58, how did you make yours? Which tools did you use?
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Also about the torque at the higher end, does that detract from the power I already have at lower RPMs, or does it leave that portion alone and just increase the top end?
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Also about the torque at the higher end, does that detract from the power I already have at lower RPMs, or does it leave that portion alone and just increase the top end?
I just used pine and ordinary had tools for mine. I'm not sure if there'd be any soaking in (the fuel into the wood) problem but figured it was worth a shot. A lot of people use spacers made of wood (even plywood).
I've never priced it, but that's good to know about the aluminimum; may have to check out eBay for some blocks of AL. I think there are different types of phenolic material. It's a little pricey too, but sometimes you can catch a good deal on eBay. All in all, I wonder how much material matters for throttle body and MPI systems. My understanding of the advantage of the insulating characteristics of the spacer was that it would keep fuel in the carburetor fuel bowl(s) cooler allowing a denser mixture. Can't see as you'd have that effect with a FI system.
I would guess YES, that you may increase both HP and TQ, but it will be at a higher RPM and that your HP and TQ at lower RPM would likely drop a little. From everything I've read, spacers are a crapshoot and thickness needs to be played with. I think the largest group of users were originally drag racers. I guess moving the power band up the RPM scale helped allow the tires to catch at launch while extra power was added as you got further down the track. I think playing with the spacers gave performance improvements/losses in tenths of a second.
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Hrm... I just wanted a little extra kick in my Tracker without shelling out hundreds of dollars on headers and cams... Also, if you have pictures, could you post them?