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ZUKIWORLD Discussion Forum => Technical Discussion - Beginner / Repair => Topic started by: hwyman on March 24, 2016, 02:47:42 PM
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I am working on a 94 2 dr 4 wd Tracker 1.6l 8v
About 6 weeks ago on my way home from work my tracker just died like I had switched off the key. I tried to start it using starting fluid and it would not start. I did a compression test and everything was around 80-90 so thinking the gear on the crank had slipped again I pulled evrything apart like I did about 3 yrs ago and the keyway repair was still in good shape so I put everything back in place with a new timing belt and set everything to #4 cylinder. Still would not start.
So i put the checked for spark at the spark plugs and have no spark there
I tried to get the CEL to flash the codes and it would not flash so I thought ok the ecu is bad so I picked up a used one and got it installed. No flashing CEL and still not starting
I checked for voltage at the coil and I have 11.98 V coming into the coil
I checked the resistance of the coil and the primary resistance was higher than spec so I replaced it under warranty. No start
I had the ignition module tested and it tested good. Still no start
I replaced the crank sensor in the distributor no start and no spark at plugs
I replaced the distributor cap and rotor button. No start and mot spark at plugs
I pulled everything back apart and dbl checked that I had the timing set correctly No spark and no start
I have checked the ignition fuse about a dozen times and it is not blown
I am stumped what else to check
Please help
Travis
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I tried to get the CEL to flash the codes and it would not flash so I thought ok the ecu is bad so I picked up a used one and got it installed. No flashing CEL and still not starting
THIS is where you start ...
Does the CEL come on when you turn the key on - if not - find out why & fix it.
Diagrams are available at Acks' FAQ.
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Yes the CEL light does come on but will not flash codes
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There's a switch under the dash, somewhere near the left speaker, find it & flip it and then try again - if you're not getting at the very least a code 12, you have an ECU or ECU related problem.
There car has a feature that brings the CEL on every 50,000 miles or so to remind you to have the emissions control system checked, and that switch turns the light back off.
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Yes the CEL light does come on but will not flash codes
Did you jumper the plug by battery? On 1991-1996 (and later?) sidekick/tracker models insert a jumper wire between the number two and three terminals of the Check connector adjacent to the battery (see illustration). Turn the ignition key on, and read the diagnostic code (the Check Engine light will blink).
Normal system operation is code twelve, (1 flash, pause two flashes)., and will blink one time only.
(http://rlb.50megs.com/graphics/tbcodeblock.jpg)
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Yes I did djump at the connector.
With the stock ecu when I had the switch under the dash pushed to one side the CEL light would come on but not flash when I pushed it to the other side the CEL would not come on at all. So thinking I had a bad ecu I purchased a used one and when I jump the connector beside the battery the CEL comes on but does not flash. I am not 100% positive I tried the switch in both positions with the new to me ecu. I will stop by my mother in laws house (where I had it towed to) after work and dbl check the position of the switch and if the CEL does the same thing as the stock ecu
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If the CEL doesn't flash then there is a problem with the ECU or the wiring to it. Its possible that you have a bad connection to the monitor coupler (diagnostic connector). Do you hear any relays clicking when you turn on the ignition?
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mine did the same thing and I sent the ECM out and had it rebuilt by a guy in Ohio
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Finally had a chance to stop by my tracker today and if I put the jumper in at the connector beside the battery and crank the engine for 5 seconds or so the CEL comes on but does not flash. Turn the key off and slide the switch under the dash to the other side and crank the engine for 5 seconds or so the CEL does not come on nor does it flash. It did the same thing with the stock ecu and the ecu that I bought used.
Does this point to 2 bad ecus?
Is there a definative test to do to rule out the ecu or do I just send my stock ecu off to be fixed and hope it is the cause?
I may have a line on an ecu from a 94 2door 2wd tracker from a running engine. Will the 2wd exu work in my 4wd tracker?
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Under normal circumstances ...
1) Key on, engine off, no jumper, no cranking - CEL should be on, goes off after engine start.
2) Key on, engine off, jumper in, no cranking - CEL should be flashing.
If the CEL remains on after engine start, there is either a code set or the "service engine soon" (SES) system has flipped over - this is when you insert the jumper and count the flashes as in #2 above. If the CEL stays on rather than flashing, you reset the SES by flipping the slide switch, and then the CEL should flash, count them, if it's a code 12 (no problem detected), pull the jumper, service the engine and continue.
From what you say, it seems like the only way you get the CEL on is with the switch - this suggests either a defective ECU or an ECU wiring related issue.
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mine did the same thing and I sent the ECM out and had it rebuilt by a guy in Ohio
Do you have contact information for the guy that did yours?
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his name is David Ruberg
Speedometer Repair Guy
123 Sarnia St
Winona Mn 55987
507-429-4489
It took about a week and I think it was about $90
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ok here is what I have done recently
I purchased a running parts vehicle. same year etc as mine
I started swapping parts from the running vehicle over to mine so far I have changed:
the ignition module
coil
distributor
fuse block under the hood mine was corroded
ecu
still does not start and the same story on the CEL no flash..with the switch on one side it will come on and stay on with the key turned slide the switch to the other side the light does not come on or flash.
so it appears that I need to download the wiring diagram and see if that helps any
or find a mechanic
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Is there a relay that controls the ECU?
if so where is it located?
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Just for giggles, look Dow the oil filler to see if the cam shaft is turning, then look under the distributor to see if that's turning.
But no CEL means computer not ready. Check fuses, all your engine and body grounds. Do any other ignition lights come on? I had a bad ignition key contact on a 95 once. The car didn't know it was supposed to be on. My 98 also had a slightly bad ignition switch. Maybe find a switched 12 volt circuit and check to see if you have it.
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I have checked to see it the distributor is turning and it is. I have not looked in the oil filler to see of the cam is turning but if I can get someone to turn the key I will try that this week.
everything else works just will not start.
Fuses have been checked a dosen times and even replaced with new ones
I know when I finally figure this out it will be something simple
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1 - If the distributor is turning, the cam is turning - the crank drives the cam via a toothed belt, the cam drives the distributor through gears.
2 - There is no relay that controls the ECU, there are two relays that the ECU controls - one, the main FI relay, switches power to the ignition, injector, idle valve, etc., the second, controls the fuel pump.
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Well it is not the relay
I guess my next move is to pull the key switch from my parts vehicle and put it in my DD to see if that is the problem
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Random (or guided guess) part swapping can be extremely frustrating, not to mention expensive - get a test meter and focus on the ECU power circuits - diagrams should be available at Ack's FAQ, they may not match, but they should be close enough to get you into the ball park.
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All parts are being swapped from a running parts tracker I bought about a month ago so cost is not an issue but the frustration is.
I will have to go to the local library and see if I can download the wiring diagram, I can not do it at work thanks to the firewall and the home computer has a virus thanks to the nephew wanting to download music.
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Let me ask you this - you bought that Tracker after you started having problems, IF this car was running, would you have bought it? Do you still think cost is a non issue?
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Yes I definitely would have bought it for the price I got it for.
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Well I got the keyswitch replaced this afternoon and it still does not start and the cel will still not flash
I will try to get the wiring diagrams downloaded and start tracing wires this week.
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If you put the ecu in the other tracker does it run? Didn't just kill your new ecu?
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Also, the computer needs to see the engine cranking to fire injectors or spark. You'll need a wiring diagram, and see if the cap position sensor or anything like it is getting a signal. It will be a high frequency pulse, can see it on AC setting. Verify +12 and ground on all pins necessary. Without it the computer doesn't know when to cycle injectors and spark.
Anybody have a wiring diagram to share so we can help this poor guy out?
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Hope this helps.
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Thanks for the wiring diagram It should help
I will get it printed and put it to use
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Bandit86 i swapped the original ecu back into my parts tracker and as soon as I find the underhood fuse block and put it in I will see if it starts.
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Well the weather and life cooperated and I found the fuse block and got it installed along with my original ecu and after I remembered to hook up the battery it started right up
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That's good. Eliminates the ECU. So we need to check the input pins for power, and ground. Do you have any electrical background?
If you have 2 trackers side by side it might be even easier. Go to the ECU, with ignition on check all the pins for 12v to ground, resistance to, and for ground from 12 volt supply. Compare to other tracker.
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No unfortunately they are 20 miles apart. I can use a multimeter so it is just a matter of time to chase the wires.
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Write down what you have on each pin on the good one. Should help narrow down the problem. I still think a main feed is missing.
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I think this will help.
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Thanks to the wiring diagrams and standing on my head under the dash I was able to find the bad wire and fix it.
Thanks everyone for the help
Travis
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Bet that feels pretty good. So shorted wire was the culprit or loose connection?
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Loose wire in the connector to the ecm.