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Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???

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Offline Toys-n-Joys

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2019, 10:52:40 PM »
Quote from: herman pahls on October 24, 2019, 03:05:20 PM
I am currently doing the Toyota IFS swap with the kit as pictured 2 posts above.
Needed
1    Kit from Australia or is it New Zealand?  I have had it for years and just getting to installing since I went to 35" tires.
2....Hagen mod or in my case the lift kit I am using already has 2-1/2" wider and 1-1/2" moved forward A-arms.
3    2  Toyota IFS front axles from 1986-1095 pickup. these CV axles make the Tracker axles look tiny.
4    2 Warn manual locking hubs part number 28761 or equivalent.
5    Left side axle conversion to the right side so you can use same axle both sides

I also had Trail Tough assemble for  me an all steel front diff and housing.


Hmm i wonder if this will work with the calmini a arms. I have to add this to the list if i dont have to widen it
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Offline herman pahls

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2019, 11:51:54 AM »
Regarding why I went with Toyota IFS front axles and the required Hagen Mod (or 2-1/2" wider A arms in my case) and right side stub axle conversion to use the same axle on both sides.
You only need to carry one spare, they appear to be way beefier and so far I have not heard them click like the stock IFS Tracker axles do from my experience.
Even though I have yet to break a Tracker IFS axle on 33's, I did not feel they would last long on the 35" tires I recently started using.
If you are only planning on using up to 32-33" tires and no front locker,  I would stick with the stock Tracker axles, but do the right side stub axle conversion which requires the Hagen mod.
The advantage of staying with Tracker axles is that if the sway bar is removed, the axles can be replaced in a few minutes without  jacking up the vehicle or removing the wheel and tire.









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Online fordem

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2019, 08:46:20 PM »
If you're hearing the stock CV axles clicking, it'll be because they are worn and need to be replaced, not because they are in some way inferior to the Toyota axles - the Toyota axles will also click when worn.
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Offline herman pahls

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2019, 03:13:54 PM »
I agree that  worn CV's will click, be it Suzuki or Toyota; so will CV's that are asked to have more angle than they were designed for.
I have 2 Trackers, both of which the stock CV's did not click until I lifted them.
Of course the clicking is only when under load and when approaching full lock steering.
Not all CV's are designed to tolerate the same combined angle; the steering angle plus the increased angle when doing a lift.
The Toyota axles I used were salvage yard finds.
Possibly they did not click because they are designed to handle more combined angle than the Suzuki's or I was lucky that they were in better condition.
What I know for sure is the Toyota CV's make the Suzuki CV's look miniature and therefore assume they are more up to the task with 35" tires


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Offline Toys-n-Joys

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2019, 08:57:10 PM »
Quote from: herman pahls on November 06, 2019, 11:51:54 AM
Regarding why I went with Toyota IFS front axles and the required Hagen Mod (or 2-1/2" wider A arms in my case) and right side stub axle conversion to use the same axle on both sides.
You only need to carry one spare, they appear to be way beefier and so far I have not heard them click like the stock IFS Tracker axles do from my experience.
Even though I have yet to break a Tracker IFS axle on 33's, I did not feel they would last long on the 35" tires I recently started using.
If you are only planning on using up to 32-33" tires and no front locker,  I would stick with the stock Tracker axles, but do the right side stub axle conversion which requires the Hagen mod.
The advantage of staying with Tracker axles is that if the sway bar is removed, the axles can be replaced in a few minutes without  jacking up the vehicle or removing the wheel and tire.


I just want to bulletproof this sidekick and make it a fun lasting offroad and road friendly 4x4.

I hear people are doing the drivers side axle mod without the hagen mod. I hope i can pull that off. From sounds of it the 26spline Suzuki axles should be plenty for me. I plan on a arb front locker as well. Maybe a chinese unit haven't decided yet.

Darel at vitmods says he can weld up the drivers side mod and maybe make it a little shorter to compensate for the length of the driver's side mod without doing the Hagen widening mod. But he only has the 22 spline stubs in stock. I want to swap to 26spline and steel housing asap.

I have some 31x10.5r15 Couragia M/Ts.


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Offline herman pahls

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2019, 11:48:35 AM »
Before I went with the 2-1/2" wider arms on each side and using stock A-arms, I did the left side axle on the right side without the Hagen mod..
To make this happen required machining and welding the new right side  stub axle as short as possible.
In my situation this required that the lower 2 bolts that hold the right side differential bracket were converted to countersunk bolts and the 3 bolts that bolt the axle to the stub axle were also converted to countersunk.
With the Hagen mod countersunk bolts would not be needed.
Since I have yet to have a CV axle failure (I have worn them so they start clicking) with 32-33" tires in 10 years, I would probably just carry both axles as spares.
Then when the right side axle fails it will require a lot of work to change out on the trail and then u will wish you had the 2 left side axle mod.
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Online fordem

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2019, 02:08:18 PM »
Quote from: herman pahls on November 13, 2019, 11:48:35 AM
Before I went with the 2-1/2" wider arms on each side and using stock A-arms, I did the left side axle on the right side without the Hagen mod..
To make this happen required machining and welding the new right side  stub axle as short as possible.
In my situation this required that the lower 2 bolts that hold the right side differential bracket were converted to countersunk bolts and the 3 bolts that bolt the axle to the stub axle were also converted to countersunk.

This is good to know, I wouldn't mind running left side axles on both sides, but I am not keen on widening the track any.

A few questions if you don't mind ...

a) Is this on a first or second gen vehicle?
b) What suspension modifications did you have at the time - I believe lift affects this as the axle length becomes shorter as the suspension droops.

I have acquired a complete front axle assembly that matches my second gen, so most of the parts needed are probably already on hand.
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Offline herman pahls

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #22 on: November 19, 2019, 12:38:25 PM »
Quote from: fordem on November 13, 2019, 02:08:18 PM
This is good to know, I wouldn't mind running left side axles on both sides, but I am not keen on widening the track any.

A few questions if you don't mind ...

a) Is this on a first or second gen vehicle?
b) What suspension modifications did you have at the time - I believe lift affects this as the axle length becomes shorter as the suspension droops.

I have acquired a complete front axle assembly that matches my second gen, so most of the parts needed are probably already on hand.

That Tracker was a 1995 2 door.
Not sure what generation that is.
The lift was a trail tough 2-1/2" springs and shocks.
Before starting the right side to a left side axle conversion, measure the left side from a repeatable point and transfer that measurement to the right side.
This measurement will tell you exactly where the new stub axle to inner CV interface needs to be.
Maybe I did not need to do the countersunk bolts to get the needed length
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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #23 on: November 19, 2019, 02:26:35 PM »
Thanks much for the details...

A 95 is a first gen, or SE series,.
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Offline Drone637

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2019, 03:13:59 PM »
Instead of a widening mod on the frame we just modified the end of the a-arm to have a new mounting position for the lower ball joint.  Might be easier to go that route if you want to sit a bit wider and lower.  We have found that moving the mounting point 1 1/2” forward and 3/4” wider on each side gives you extra room for the tires and does not change your steering geometry.

I did need to have a spacer create for the drivers side to stop blowing out the stock CV's after the mod.
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Online fordem

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #25 on: November 21, 2019, 05:10:36 PM »
That's not really an option on a second gen - they have cast LCAs with an integrated ball joint - I'm not about to shell out the coin for aftermarket tubular arms, hence my curiosity in how it was done with the stock arms - I'll probably find the time this weekend to put the CV axles side-by-side and evaluate my options.
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Offline herman pahls

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Re: Toyota front cv axle swap...... just what is needed.....???
« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2020, 03:35:12 PM »
I finished the install of the Toyota IFS front axles last fall using the Australian conversion kit and tried them out on the Rubicon.
This was also my 1st time on the trail on 35 x 12:50 tires.
These little Geo/Suzuki's are amazing, but as you all know it takes serious modifications.

In my group was a leaf spring Toyota on 37's, a custom rock buggy on 40's and coil overs and a new Polaris turbo S with stock coil over suspension.
I was the only one without lockers and struggled more than they did on the more difficult obstacles.

My point in mentioning the other vehicles suspension is that they all commented that my Geo appeared to get down the trail faster and smoother than they were comfortable traveling..
I feel this is an advantage of the Geo IFS front suspension and rear coil springs and 35" tires with 8 psi.

Ten miles into the trail I lost front wheel drive.
I had lost the bolts that hold on one sides locking hub, and all the rest of the bolts to the locking hub adapter and hub were lose on both sides.
Since returning home and using lock tight, the bolts are still coming loose with local wheeling on 31" tires.
I never had bolts coming lose on stock Geo locking hubs with which I was using 2-1/2" longer Vitara left side axles to go with the 2-1/2" longer control arms.
My conclusion is that since I am using 2-1/2" wider control arms and have more suspension travel than stock control arms with the Hagen Mod,  that I am either binding the Toyota IFS axles
 or exceeding the angle that the Toyota CV's were intended.
The next issue is that with the adapter needed between the hub and warn locking hubs, the locking hubs stick out too far and I have already damaged the warn hub cover with the engagement knob.
It reminds me of a 70's Chevy pick up on narrow tires.

As I said several posts ago before I trail tested the Toyota IFS axle conversion, I would stick with the stock Suzuki axles, do the conversion so you are using left side axles on both sides and carry a spare which will only take a few minutes to change out on the trail if the sway bar is removed.

i will be going back to the Vitara axles and see how they hold up to the 35" tires.
i may need to carry 2 spares.


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