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samurai running hot

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samurai running hot
« on: February 10, 2011, 04:25:50 PM »
i have a 86 tin top samurai and i have had the radator flushed and it has a electric fan. well today the water pump started leaking so i replaced it and i also replaced the thermasat with  A 180 degree . now its running hot . it didnt have one in it so should i get a lower degree or just pull it out?

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2011, 05:41:15 PM »
What makes you think it's running hot now ?  What are the symptoms?  When does it run hot?  At idle?  In traffic?  On the freeway?

The first thing I want to point out is that an engine without a thermostat will usually run cooler than it should, which is not the best thing for it - so if your concern is the needle on the gauge now being further up the gauge, that may not be a problem, but just the engine now running at the correct temperature.

The second thing I want to point out is that the Samurai didn't come with an electric fan standard, so that you have a second "variable" that needs to be considered if in fact you do have an over heat condition.

A lot may depend on the "quality" of the fan install - is it large enough, is it in a shroud, is it thermostatically controlled?
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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2011, 06:05:14 PM »
 the gauge is pegged all the way hot after it runs for a min. the electric fan comes on when the samurai is running. before i replaced the water pump it was running 3/4 of the way up the gauge. the electric fan is the biggest i could fit.

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2011, 04:18:42 AM »
The gauge is pegged all the way hot in less than two minutes after the engine starts from cold?  You have a problem with either the gauge or the sender - the engine won't (can't) warm up that rapidly.

You can get yourself an IR temperature gun for around $40 (Sears or Harbor Freight) and verify the engine's operating temperature - measure it around the intake manifold/thermostat cover area - if you're not seeing over the 180* that matches the thermostat you're using, then the gauge is not displaying the correct temperature.
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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2011, 05:33:18 AM »
when it got that hot  it started running like crap. it would not go

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2011, 06:54:54 AM »
That does suggest an overheat problem - BUT - based on personal experience - it takes way longer than a minute to get an engine up to operating temperature from a cold start, much less to get it to over heat.

You have two symptoms, both of which are pointing to an over temp condition - but - there's no way to generate enough heat energy to raise the temperature of the engine block by 100* or so (from 80* to 180*) in under a minute without some sort of explosive detonation.

The reality is that at this point, you have no idea what the temperature actually is, and without some form of measurement all you're doing is guessing.

For the sake of discussion, let's say you have an electrical problem - maybe a bad ground - it is entirely possible for that to  affect both the gauge reading and the ignition system.

And for the sake of further discussion, lets say I'm looking in the wrong direction, and there actually is a problem causeing an overheat condition - do you want to fix the problem or mask it by removing the thermostat and futzing with fan?
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Offline bentparts

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2011, 04:16:47 PM »
Not real familar with the 1.3 sammy engine, do you have to remove the timing belt to do the water pump like on a tracker? If so you may have the timing way retarded, a couple teeth off. It would start and run, but really crappy and get HOT from the late ignition.
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Offline c3006

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2011, 04:22:38 PM »
Which way do you have the air blowing from your fan? If you have it wired to blow air forward instead of pulling rearward it will overheat.   :)

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2011, 04:57:21 PM »
Not real familar with the 1.3 sammy engine, do you have to remove the timing belt to do the water pump like on a tracker? If so you may have the timing way retarded, a couple teeth off. It would start and run, but really crappy and get HOT from the late ignition.

Yes - the engines are physically quite similar, the 1.6 block is just a little taller to accomodate the longer stroke.

Do you think it could run hot enough to pin the gauge within a minute or so from a cold start?  The other peculiarity is that he says it started running like crap when it got hot, which suggests it was running well before it got hot.
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Offline bentparts

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Re: samurai running hot
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2011, 04:25:21 AM »
I'm just taking a guess here, I too have never seen an engine get that hot so fast. Unless it's an idling top fuel-er! I do believe though there was something wrong before he did the work, and now it's just ex agerated.
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