One more thing Ross, unless you want people to continue to think your talking AT them instead of to them, lay off the caps lock.

He also doesn't do credit card, the money needs to deposited in his account first.

I was going to get some bits off them at one time but that put me off. With the credit card at least I would have some come back.
If you get the A arms you will need the diff drop brackets as well or the driveshafts will too short.

You know i wouldn't expect Trail Tough to sell any part of their SAS kit separately right now, since it is new, and it's all designed to work with the other components they make with it.

BUT, i would expect that since calmini has been selling these for years now, and we all know that you can use some of their parts with other brands of parts, you would think they'd start selling the parts individually.

How many people do you see these days with the following assortment of parts on their trucks:

Shrockworks front bumper, 2" coil spacers, OME struts, Pro comp rear shocks, ARB front locker, lock rite rear locker, viair compressor, home made snorkel with safari snorkel air ram up top, shrockworks sliders with trail tough rear bumper.

Imagine if those companies only sold their parts in complete kits, like calmini.  You wouldn't get all the choices of what exactly you wanted to put on your vehicle.  (did you notice how mixed i made the parts, and yet, it's completely possible to do all that)

It all seems very strange to me that calmini makes other parts in bits and pieces to be sold separately (like their exhaust parts), but yet they won't break up the suspension.

WOW! I just did a conversion to usd from Turkish lira, and that stuff is pretty inexpensive. I sent them an email, if they ship to the US I may go for it.

Okay, I was LURKING, but have to chime in.

This is a foreign company that is producing a KNOCK-OFF of the Calmini system, and a poor knock-off at that, as the geometery is wrong.

You might take this wrong, and if so, good.  HOW UN-AMERICAN TO BUY PIRATED GOODS FROM A FOREIGN COMPANY?!?!

This is wrong on several levels.  If you want bits, buy the kit and you can buy replacements for any thing Calmini sells.  Call Skyjacker and try to buy half the system.  Simple business savy will tell you what it is what it is.

To think you'd short the american people by buying knock-off crap so you can save a few bucks.  Really sad. 

If you didn't know it was a knock off (which would surprise me since anyone could notice who they are copying), then now you do.  Proceed with the sale and you're pretty un-American.

Enuff said.  I remain...

Yeah, I think that even if I did get a response from them, which seems unlikely, I would be leery of transferring funds with no recourse either. Did Anyone actually hear back from them? A bit of an update: I spoke with a helpful sales rep at Calmini and they agreed to sell their 3" lift kit without the shocks and struts. The difference in price would only be $100 less. I bet If you had to order replacement shocks and struts(which they do offer)it would be a bunch more than $100.The 3" lift kits are on back order for 4 or more weeks due to their "popularity."

Just a thought.

Can anyone confirm if all of the Calmini lift parts are in fact made in the USA or not?  Their backorder wait time is representative of sea freight shipping delays (like from china or taiwan).

Wow Yankee Tim, tell us how you really feel. How do you know the geometry is wrong? Do you have any personal experience with these products? BTW, I've spent over 8 years in military service of this country, defending MY freedom and Yours. Watch who your calling un American. I'll spend my money wherever I damn well please. And as for taking money from the American people, just how ignorant can you be? I'd guess that at least half of Calmini's products are assembled across the border in Mexico, as are most of the products we consume as Americans. Maybe I should sell the Suzuki and buy an American truck. Wait a minute,  there isn't an " American" built vechile that is completely built from American parts. Mexico, Japan, Canada, Spain, Korea, Germany, Italy and China all contribute parts to "American" built stuff. You might want to re-think your narrow minded view of the world before you go off on another rant.

mostly all of calmini parts are made in house.  as for time  if they are running a arm parts ,you can't exspeci them to stop and make one other part just for you. it's not practicle.
i ran a weld shop for 20 years and there product is superb.

Quote from: bentparts on February 11, 2007, 02:34:09 PM

WOW! I just did a conversion to usd from Turkish lira, and that stuff is pretty inexpensive. I sent them an email, if they ship to the US I may go for it.

Okay, I was LURKING, but have to chime in.

This is a foreign company that is producing a KNOCK-OFF of the Calmini system, and a poor knock-off at that, as the geometery is wrong.

You might take this wrong, and if so, good.  HOW UN-AMERICAN TO BUY PIRATED GOODS FROM A FOREIGN COMPANY?!?!

This is wrong on several levels.  If you want bits, buy the kit and you can buy replacements for any thing Calmini sells.  Call Skyjacker and try to buy half the system.  Simple business savy will tell you what it is what it is.

To think you'd short the american people by buying knock-off crap so you can save a few bucks.  Really sad. 

If you didn't know it was a knock off (which would surprise me since anyone could notice who they are copying), then now you do.  Proceed with the sale and you're pretty un-American.

Enuff said.  I remain...

Hey moron.  You riding around in a suzuki???   You wanna tell people how to spend their money eh?   I know if someone tried telling me what to do with my money I'd knock 'em in the teeth.

OK, lets get this straight. I have Calmini products. They are good quality. Their customer service has been good to me in the past. This is not the issue. Most everyone who frequents this or any other Suzuki forum knows Calmini's springs are stiff, too say the least and their shocks and struts are generic at best. I'd be willing to bet money they don't actually manufacture their own shocks and struts, just buy whatever from whomever. Same with the springs. The quality of their manufactured suspension components is without debate, good. We all know it. We want it. And once again, the fact that I stated that the kits are on back order is neither a dig at Calmini, nor a criticism of their business practices. It was a simple statement of fact. Jeez, lighten the f*#% up people.

if this 4xfourart.com cant speek english then why can they have a website in english. 
Has anyone gotten a reply yet.  i would kinda like to order one

No.

Wow Yankee Tim, tell us how you really feel.

I usually don't mince words. And right now I feel nervous as I'm getting remarried tomorrow.

How do you know the geometry is wrong? Do you have any personal experience with these products?

Second hand, yes.  I know a special "someone" who bought the kit and did so for a very particular reason.  Side by side it's a copy, but poorly reversed engineered.  Specs aren't the same and poor constuction quality compared to the patented US-made original.  International trade laws are a murky and expensive area, and fighting the good fight might not be worth it in the long run

BTW, I've spent over 8 years in military service of this country, defending MY freedom and Yours.

And I appreciate that very much, as any one who has served our nation.  Protecting freedoms is paramount to being a good American.   And one of those freedoms was the ability to express consideration that another's actions may be counter to the nation's interests.

Watch who your calling un American.

I'll think what I want to think about others and their actions.  A good american can do un-american things, many times without even knowing it.  We're not talking buying Chevy vs. Toyota here.  This is no different than buying knock-off Oakleys at a flea market.  One may know it's not the real thing,  may know the original patented version if made in the US, but one buys it because it saves them money, not considering the repercussions.

I'll spend my money wherever I damn well please.

As you have a right to.  As should anyone, regardless of who that purchase may or may not effect.  It's the moral implications of the purchase that can trouble some.

And as for taking money from the American people, just how ignorant can you be?

Let's see, hmmmm, if I try real hard, I *could* be pretty ignorant.  Almost as ignorant as someone who didn't find piracy objectionable.

I'd guess that at least half of Calmini's products are assembled across the border in Mexico,

Good guess, but completely wrong.

as are most of the products we consume as Americans.

Much better guess, but still wrong.  We buy most of our crap from China now.  Seems many US businesses don't care for their own country.  Even ATV's that are pirated from Yamaha Motor Company USA come from China

Http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2005_Nov_18/ai_n15860374

Funny how a company selling pirated goods in the US runs by the name "Patriot".

Maybe I should sell the Suzuki and buy an American truck.

Why?  Did Suzuki pirate a US design?   This is not even close to what I said or meant.  If a Mexican company popped up selling Brent's "Trail Slayer" kit for less than Brent, then it would be the same.  If a Chinese company was selling knock-off patented ARBs with parts that interchange, then it would be the same thing.  If I bought a DVD at a flea market of the lastest movie that isn't even out yet, it would be the same thing.  If Yamoto was set up to sell un-licensed Yamaha Raptor copies, it would be the same thing.  (wait a minute, that did happen)

Wait a minute,  there isn't an " American" built vechile that is completely built from American parts. Mexico, Japan, Canada, Spain, Korea, Germany, Italy and China all contribute parts to "American" built stuff.

True, but again, what you are talking about is global economics, not piracy.  When China starts spitting out un-licensed carbon-copy Ford parts and sells them in the US, then it's a piracy issue (which may happen sooner than we think).  http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2007701220335

Fact is, if you want to help the US economy, buying a foreign built truck sold by Chevy results in more revenue for our government than a US-built truck sold by Toyota. www.howtobuyamerican

You might want to re-think your narrow minded view of the world before you go off on another rant.

Actually, its not very narrow at all.  If anything, it's looking at the bigger picture. 

Now, I knew my post was going to create sparks, but I'm not looking for a slugfest.  That should be beneath us.  I honestly don't think you knew it was a pirated suspension system.  It looks new and exciting, and could serve your immediate needs.  But now you do know.  Hopefully, that may impact a decision to buy it or not.  Don't forget, but from Turkistanbul thru an interpreter doesn't instill confidence.

As for the suspension, there are reasons they won't sell just a few parts.  It's designed to work together, for one.  Secondly, liability.  But mostly, it's a business decision.  Calmini is friggin huge now, and with their Full Traction line bing red hot, they are balls to the wall in production.  I't s not the same small company it once was in the late 80's.  They work in production runs and use a crystal ball to judge future demand.  Sometimes they guess right, sometimes not.  The last thing any company wants is to misjudge demand and end up with excess product on the shelf.  The run will come up and the kits will be available again.

I know you want the a-arm to put the geometry back in line while using your OME set-up.  But the Calmini struts are stock length, and they need to be. Calmini could have used the longer struts like OME sells, but didn;t for a reason.  With the OME struts being longer, combined with the different geometery of the Calmini A-arms, it will put the CVs out of the degree of operability.  This can cause more extension of the the control arm, allowing the CV to run at an angle that is weak and prone to breakage, as well as possible pulling apart from over-extension.  Either of these two scenarios are most likely not what you intend to have happen.  Can you run the Calmini front with stock struts?  Yes, but they include them to make it complete, since most of these kits go onto used (and sometimes abused) trucks, new struts only make sense.  The Calmini rear is competely different of a lift than OME has.  With the redesigned upper mount, it eliminated the tear apart of the stock upper link which happens with a 3" lift.  *Maybe* the OME shocks can be used back there, but I dunno.

Now, if you can save some flow by buying the Calmini kit, sans struts and shocks, that's cool and you're getting the real stuff.  but take what I said about the OME struts seriously, or you could end up with breakage in some form, which no one wants.  Even Calmini will tell you the same thing I did.


Lastly, there is no need for bad blood here.  I shouldn't be flying off the handle about being un-american and all, and I apologize.  I just couldn't help but feel irrate by the piracy issue, which many people ignore if it benefits them, not thinking of the ramifications of that decision.  Doesn't matter who or what product it is, if it's a US product protected under patent, trademark and/or copyright laws, I really hate when foreign companies pull this crap and effect american jobs and commerce.  Take WARN for example, the chinese are copying WARN winches verbatim under the names of Viper and Venom and Gorilla and such, and selling them for 1/4 the price.  This is good if you want a Warn winch and don't want to pay a Warn price.  This is bad for Warn though, as they are the innovators that developed those winches in the first place.  Take away the profit motive, then the innovation goes away as well.  Same could be said for Calmini.

Junk food for thought.  Zook on.

As for the suspension, there are reasons they won't sell just a few parts.  It's designed to work together, for one.  ..........

I know you want the a-arm to put the geometry back in line while using your OME set-up.  But the Calmini struts are stock length, and they need to be. Calmini could have used the longer struts like OME sells, but didn;t for a reason.  With the OME struts being longer, combined with the different geometery of the Calmini A-arms, it will put the CVs out of the degree of operability.  This can cause more extension of the the control arm, allowing the CV to run at an angle that is weak and prone to breakage, as well as possible pulling apart from over-extension.  Either of these two scenarios are most likely not what you intend to have happen.  Can you run the Calmini front with stock struts?  Yes, but they include them to make it completee, since most of these kits go onto used (and sometimes abused) trucks, new struts only make sense.  The Calmini rear is competely different of a lift than OME has.  With the redesigned upper mount, it eliminated the tear apart of the stock upper link which happens with a 3" lift.  *Maybe* the OME shocks can be used back there, but I dunno.

Now, if you can save some flow by buying the Calmini kit, sans struts and shocks, that's cool and you're getting the real stuff.  but take what I said about the OME struts seriously, or you could end up with breakage in some form, which no one wants.  Even Calmini will tell you the same thing I did.

As you say the Calmini system is designed to work together.....on a particular setup. Not everyone runs a winch and winchbar and some have swb and some lwb etc. etc. The spring rates do not suit all applications and the struts and shocks supplied are certainly not the optimum. As for using OME struts, well I have run the Calmini system with the OME struts for quite some time now and I wouldn't run it any other way. Does it push the CV's limits? Yes but it still hasn't been a problem for me, maybe it's just the way I drive. For those who are concerned they could always use the OME struts without the supplied strut spacers or make up some shorter spacers or use Stan's Toy CV mod..

The Piracy issue is something else altogether but there is a market for just some parts from the kit and Calmini has made a business decision not to supply those parts separately so people will look for other solutions rightly or wrongly as is their right.  I have also heard that the control arms are not as good as the Calmini arms.

Calmini could have used the longer struts like OME sells, but didn;t for a reason.  With the OME struts being longer, combined with the different geometery of the Calmini A-arms, it will put the CVs out of the degree of operability.  This can cause more extension of the the control arm, allowing the CV to run at an angle that is weak and prone to breakage, as well as possible pulling apart from over-extension. 

The Calmini 3" kit includes 2" strut spacers, with these the struts are effectively 1/2" longer than the OME struts. The CVs aren't an issue with the drop brackets fitted. Like I said before if you fit the drop arms then you will need the drop brackets or your shafts will be too short.
The geometry being wrong is an issue with the Calmini kit as well. Its an IFS problem more than anything else. Unless the weight on the nose is right then the camber is going to be wrong.
I did exchange several emails with the Turkish company. My centre diff bracket was lost when I moved house and Calmini wouldn't replace it because I bought the kit used and didn't have the original receipt. This was a couple of years ago and no one I knew of had dealt with the Turkish company. Like I said earlier I didn't go ahead with it because I didn't like the idea of a money transfer to an unknown company in a different country.

All this has come up before, a search of the board should get the details. IIRC someone here from Greece wheeled with a couple of people who had this kit. The specs are different. I've never seen one personally but you can see from the pics that the A arm is slightly different in design, particularly in the way the coil locates. Thats probably all it needs to avoid patent issues, AFAIK the design of a wishbone isn't patented so unless its identical and Calmini have actually patented their design then its just a wishbone.
I do agree with the comments about buying copied kit. It may be cheaper but most of the vendors out there are enthusiasts who support our hobby and work hard to bring us this stuff. However if they won't supply then people will look elsewhere - thats supply and demand.
I'm not American so buying from the US or buying from Turkey is all the same to me. I'd rather buy from an English company but there isn't one that makes a kit like this.

Yankee Tim drives a Zuk. His name might not be familiar to some of the newer members here but hes been around a good while. He's a Zuk enthusiast like the rest of us. Good luck with the wedding Tim.